There was this old,
Rickety Episcopal cathedral in downtown Oklahoma City.
So I went to it one Sunday,
And I walk in,
And I walk down the center aisle,
And I get to where I want,
And I turn left and go in four butt spaces,
As I like to call them.
And I almost sit on this lady,
Because she's already there,
Kneeling in an attitude of prayer.
At the end,
She looked at me,
And she goes,
Introduced herself.
I'm Lilia.
I said,
I'm Jonathan.
She goes,
Would you like to come to Sunday school with me?
I find people who are spiritually aware see the Spirit everywhere.
And if you're not spiritually aware,
You don't see the Spirit.
I had those people who were so important in my life growing up,
Who just kind of were signposts pointing to me.
And so it's not that I had this big aha,
But those feelings that if you think about your grandmother and making the little night about having a dream,
Then you've learned that she passed away.
It's those sorts of,
What is that spiritual connection or that resonance in the air,
In the universe,
That speaks across time and space?
There's something that are connected.
So I've always felt a spiritual connection to other people when I meet them.
It's the concept,
I think,
That they would say out of the Sanskrit word,
Namaste.
The Spirit in me greets or acknowledges the Spirit in you.
But it's funny how I like to meet people.
So when I was 21 and I was going to medical school,
I was trying to find a church home.
And I would go into church and walk halfway down the aisle,
Literally 10 different churches,
Hang a left about two thirds of the way down,
Go about four spaces in on the traditional pew and sit and see if people would come around me.
Because I wanted to see a sense of community because I really longed for the community that I had in my childhood.
And as I finally walked into this,
And I tried the Rehearsal Terrians and the Methodist,
But there was this old rickety Episcopal cathedral in downtown Oklahoma City.
And I lived four blocks from it or something.
So I went to it one Sunday and I walk in and there's this beautiful marble altar in front of you.
It's just incredibly beautiful.
So I walked down the center aisle and I get to where I want and I turn left and go in four butt spaces,
As I like to call them.
And I almost sit on this lady because she's already there kneeling in an attitude to prayer.
And I'm like,
Oh,
That little elf I almost stepped on.
And so I joined her.
I put down the kneeler,
Not an Episcopalian,
But I put down the kneeler and I got on my knees and I prayed and had an attitude to prayer.
And we had this lovely worship service.
And at the end,
She looked at me and she goes,
Introduced herself.
I'm Lilia.
I said,
I'm Jonathan.
She goes,
Would you like to come to Sunday school with me?
I was 21.
She was 66 at the time.
I had lunch with her the day before yesterday.
She is 98 turning 99,
October the 12th.
And so Lilia has been my spiritual guide for all of these years from 21 to 53.
So is that a God instance?
Is that a magical experience?
Absolutely.
It was ordained.
I did the same ritual of walking in,
Turning left and sitting.
And people are always polite,
So glad to see you or not.
Some churches are not even talking to you because you're not one of them.
But she took me to her little old lady Sunday school class and we went to lunch together and then we started going on a rotation and it was my turn to host lunch.
I took them to the village in these three older women and me.
And you know,
I was so connected to Lilia Sapper and I still am today.
She's been praying for me to be an Episcopal priest since then.
She is beside herself that I'm completing my Masters of Divinity,
Even though within the Methodist tradition she's still hoping.
But when you meet people who live a life that is so spiritually attuned,
And so when we are talking,
Lilia will break off into spiritual prayer mid-sentence.
So I'm not really sure if she's talking to me or talking to God because she lives in that space,
That little space between the now and the future or the now and the Spirit.
And so she's been my guide for all of these years to say,
It's okay.
It's okay.
A year or so into our friendship,
I learned that she had a son who committed suicide when he was in medical school.
And I was in medical school,
So I kind of supplied that role for her family and I've been a part of the family since.
But she said to me,
Jonathan,
I don't know how people could survive losing a child if they didn't have faith or didn't have a groundedness in some spirituality.
I tell you,
It just broke my heart.
But I also thought,
Yes,
Because I have two children and I would be devastated if one passed away.
But I also know that we're just passing through.
I can tell you a hundred stories about how she has come in at the right time and spoken this word,
This elegant nugget of truth,
Because she's open to the truth.
And I think that that is,
If something has been instrumental to me and continues to be instrumental in my life,
It's just being aware of the truth of the universe.
And when we talk about faith,
I used to say when I was a younger man,
Because I've been through several different Christian denominations within the Christian faith.
I said to Lilia one day,
I said,
Lilia,
It seems like when I get a glimpse of the kingdom of heaven,
All denominations fall away.
I think I said that to her in 96,
Maybe 98,
Somewhere along in there,
25 years ago.
And then my journey,
Because I thought I was called into vocational ministry 30 years ago and I got accepted to med school the same year I was accepted to seminary and I made the decision,
Like a Gideon moment,
That if my sheepskin were dry,
That I was going to go to med school and I went to medical school.
And now that three years ago I started my journey in seminary,
I have changed my story.
And I no longer say,
When you get a glimpse of heaven,
I say,
When you get a glimpse of the divine,
All religions fall away.
What I really also love about Lilia is it's very rare to meet those people who are straddling both worlds,
That they have feet in this world and they're very here.
But then they have such a strong communion and connection to that other world,
Whatever that is,
That their soul is immersed in it.
And so they're able to speak truths.
They're able to impart knowledge and with great humility,
By the way,
If they're doing it the right way,
It's with great humility.
That is absolutely correct.
Absolutely.
Because there's no pretension.
It is,
Well,
Like my father and his connection to the land,
It wasn't necessarily quote,
Mystical and made for TV way,
But it was de facto.
It was so pragmatic.
And Lilia's pragmatism being in the world,
In the spiritual world at all times,
While being in the physical world,
Is really not up for debate.
It's just the fact of the matter.
She does.
And yeah,
She basically is an agent or an angel of the divine because she knows what to say or what words to say to you and probably to other people that help them glean a truth or realize the truth or take that little nugget and think about it for a few weeks and then have their epiphany.
She's the miracle.
She's the angel walking on earth.
And I think that's incredibly heartening and wonderful to realize that those angels haven't deserted us.
And the thing is,
They come in all sizes,
Shapes and situations.
I had professors who I know,
Divine truths have nuggets have fallen out of their lips,
Maybe without their knowing,
Right?
Because that's how the spirit speaks to us.
And they will tell a story,
Not trying to make a point A,
But you hear point C,
D,
E and F clearly.
And that is how the divine honors the message.
And so we see that even in the faith tradition.
I grew up in the Christian church,
The sermon might be given and 12 people listening heard 12 different stories.
I love having had this experience with Lily Sapper and it's a long term relationship with that.
So this is whatever that number is,
30 something years.
But I've had encounters with those angels on a routine basis.
People you,
I was at the Wild Goose Festival last year and I was sitting at the table,
This woman listening to William Barber speak,
Right?
We were just talking and then 20 minutes later,
She's disappeared,
She's moved on.
And I had such profound conversation with her and I was like,
Okay,
Did I really just have that conversation?
But I've had people that have just come in at the right time or music that has played at the right time or the smells coming out of someone's kitchen that bring you back.
I mean,
We're such complex people that we are connected on so many different levels.
This has been episode 17 of Bite-Sized Blessings,
The podcast all about the magic and spirit that surrounds us if only we open our eyes to it.
And whether you choose to listen to our Bite-Sized offering for that five to 10 minutes of freedom in your day or the longer interviews,
We're so grateful you're here.
I need to thank Jonathan Drummond for sharing his story today as well as the creators of the music used.
Raphael Crux,
Winnie the Moo,
Sasha N,
Chilled Music,
Musa Kald,
Kevin MacLeod,
Lilo Sound,
And Alexander Nakarada.
For complete attribution,
Please see the Bite-Sized Blessings website at bite-sized-blessings.
Com.
On the website,
You can find links to other goodies such as other artists,
Change makers and books that I think will lift and inspire you.
Thank you for listening and here's my one request.
Be like Jonathan.
Live the adventure,
Make sacred connections,
Never knowing where they will take you.
Take care.
Thank you.
