Why I Chose To Give Away My Possessions & Go On Vision Quest

56:49

56:49

Why I Chose To Give Away My Possessions & Go On Vision Quest

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In this interview with Nicky Clinch, I share about my journey: from a glamorous, fast-paced life in my 20’s living in the Hollywood Hills, modeling & doing music videos & TV commercials in the US & Europe, going to A-list Hollywood night clubs, using alcohol & drugs- To giving away all of my possessions until I only had the clothing on my back, embarking on a 350 mile walking pilgrimage visiting sacred sites, intentional communities, shamans & spiritual teachers to discover my true purpose

Surrender Detachment Self Love Healing Community Nature Coaching Spiritual Awakening Trauma Healing Community Support Nature Connection Visionary Thinking Source Connection Pilgrimage Vision Quests Spirits

Meet your Teacher

Uvita, Costa Rica

Meet your Teacher

Uvita, Costa Rica

Transcript

Hello everyone and welcome to the Soul Surgery Podcast. My name is Nicki Clinch and I am your host. This week we have another episode from the Surrender series where I share with you the powerful teachings of the human story. This week I get to sit with the amazing Prima Gaya that shares with us one of the most mind-blowing transformational stories I think I have ever heard. I found listening to Prima's story so moving. It moved me on so many levels. I cannot wait for you to hear this. Prima is a woman's leadership and business coach, Meditation teacher, Oracle, Visionary writer and plant spirit ceremonialist. But you know, She is like spirit incarnate. Prima used to work in Hollywood. She was surrounded by celebrities and materialism and surrounded by fame. She had the most profound download one day to give up all her possessions to completely surrender this fantasy story and picture of a world and a life and a character that she felt she needed to be, To be valued and worthy and to receive love in this world. And she let everything go. Prima shares her story in this episode about how she gave up every single material item she had and lived completely free of money while she also walked, Literally walked across countries with no money, No materialism, Just following a calling of her soul. It is by far one of the most powerful stories I have ever heard. A story of trust, A story of deep listening and a story of surrender. So I hope that you find this inspiring. Any aha moments, Shifts in perception, Insights that you get from listening to this, Please do share with me. So thank you so much for listening over to the incredible story of Prima. Hi Prima. How are you doing today? Doing wonderfully. It's so great to be here with you. It's really beautiful to sit opposite with you too. I know that we had to move this interview quite a few times. Um, And I'm always really interested by that process because there's something about it that's like life's going, No, This needs to happen now at this particular time. And when I'm sitting with you now, It's like, Oh yeah, Actually what I, What I know that you are going to share with us and what I'm really looking forward to diving into with you. This is the perfect time now for us to be having that conversation. So thank you for your patience and your commitment to being here. Um, I invited you to be part of the surrender series. So my intention is to, To continually share with the listeners the power of the process of surrender, The transformational process of surrender and the many, Many layers in which that, Um, Comes with the layer of breakdown, The layer of, Um, Opening blind spots, The layer of, Of surrendering the idea of yourself and then the transformation. And I was so excited to have you on because I know that your life has just been this enormously transformational journey, Hasn't it? Absolutely. Absolutely. And surrender has been definitely a very, Very deep theme in my life journey, In my spiritual awakening and just, You know, Finding myself standing up, You know, In the Himalaya mountains, Just with my arms outstretched up to the heavens, Just offering my entire life up to the divine and just saying, Please guide me, Please use me. And this has been, This has been something that has occurred so many times in my life. Uh, You know, Every single morning it's, You know, On my yoga mat and down on my knees in front of my altar in the space of surrender, Asking great spirit to please use me for the greatest good. And that is what my path is devoted to, Is to being in service during this time of paradigm shift and during this great global awakening that we're in right now. So it does feel like very aligned with the theme of the book Surrender. Beautiful. So when I say to you, I wanted to invite you to speak about the greatest point, The biggest point, The, The, The kind of threshold point of surrender in your life. What was, What came to mind for you? Well, I, What comes up for me was my spiritual awakening in 2006, Which I would love to share about. And before getting into that, I feel like I just would like to backtrack and share a little bit about what led up to that, To that point, To that moment. So just to give a little bit of background on my journey, You know, As I was a child growing up, I ended up incurring a lot of trauma. And at that time on my path, I didn't have tools and practices or self-awareness or the wherewithal to navigate that pain and that trauma. And so what ended up happening by the time I turned 15 years old, I discovered alcohol and then shortly after that I discovered recreational drugs. And so basically what the way that I describe it is my soul went underground for about 10 years. So I had a 10 year chapter of numbing and sedating my pain and my trauma through using substances and distract, You know, Self distraction and partying. And in that time in my life when I was in my early twenties, I ended up moving to Los Angeles and I started working in entertainment industry. And it's interesting, You know, Showing up as a young, A very impressionable young woman in Los Angeles with a deeply fragmented self, A sense of self worth. It was, As you can imagine, It was a very interesting journey. So I, I ended up starting to go get really involved in the Hollywood celebrity scene, Club scene and party scene. And so for about two years I was going out about five nights a week to a list celebrity clubs and have now been with celebrities and I ended up having experiences flying in private planes and living a very glamorous, Fast paced life. And it fed a part of me that really desired to have some sort of value and to have some sort of worth. Yes. So seductive. It was very seductive and it was, It was something that it felt like it was feeding a deep hole inside of me, But ultimately it's, You know, It was something that was never going to deeply nourish me in the way that I was seeking to be nourished. And I was receiving validation and acknowledgement based on my appearance and not based on my soul or my gifts or my wisdom or my heart. So I did enjoy that lifestyle and it was, You know, It was glamorous. It was fast paced. I was modeling in several different countries and again, Go into all these a list events and getting backstage passes to everything. And at a certain point in time I just started to discover that my behavior patterns were becoming alarmingly self destructive. Yes. So as I'm sure that, You know, Many of our listeners can relate to when you haven't done the deep inner work of unpacking the trauma and when we're just living at that surface level and living that lifestyle, It's kind of like, It feels like a ticking time bomb where it's just no inside your soul. This is not, This is not going to last, You know, Sustainable. It's not sustainable. So I had developed a, An obsessive relationship with food and exercise as many women in the entertainment industry and modeling industry at that time were also had the same issue. And so sometimes I'd be exercising like five times a day and just under eating and you know, Using alcohol and recreational drugs just to kind of keep everything on ice, So to speak. And yeah, Eventually I ended up having the biggest turning point in my life was I ended up having a spiritual awakening where I was guided to give away all of the, All of my possessions till I only had the clothes on my back and start walking and to go on a long walking pilgrimage of indeterminate length, Just following my guidance, Meeting spiritual teachers and wisdom holders and sages and shamans and visiting intentional communities and Ashrams. And so that was the biggest, I would say that was the biggest moment of my soul asking me to surrender to a higher plan in my entire life. Yes. So I want to try and unpack this so that we get inside this because I, That's just, It's a, It's an amazing story. And I, I think it's so helpful for the listeners and for us to break down these quite common phrases that are used like destructive behaviors, Addiction, Burying, Feeding this empty hole and try to get inside of it. When you look back now, I mean, You spoke about trauma and trauma is not what happens, But what happens inside of us when what happens. So when you, When you look back with hindsight in the most honest way that you can share with us, What was it that you were trying to fill or find? Yeah, Absolutely. So when I feel into that version of myself, That younger impressionable and version of myself that had not yet found self love, And I have such deep, Deep compassion for her, I actually didn't discover my way home, Back home to self love until I was 37 years old. So just the notion of walking around on this planet for 37 years and not knowing how to love myself. It's just like the level of pain and grief of just, You know, Kind of pretending or, Or, You know, Doing my best to, You know, To make things work, But not knowing my love ability or my divinity whatsoever, Not having access to it. Although I had read so many by that point, I had read so many spiritual texts, But I'll share, I'll share more about my journey to finding self love a little later. But to go back to your specific question, I remember that young girl and I used to how her thought process worked. I used to love showing my friends photographs of me with all of these celebrities or at these very high level events or dressed up to the nines in a modeling context, Or just showing people my modeling portfolio. It was my one access point at that time to feeling like I had value. Yes, Value. So you see, This is what's really important to catch, You know, Because this is just universal to human behavior and to human nature, You know, The human condition. We can never have enough of what we never really wanted. You were seeking something. You weren't bad. You weren't sick. You were seeking something, But you were seeking for it in all in places that weren't going to give you that. So inside the validation, Because you speak about, I didn't have a connection to the myself love, But really what that is, Is an unworthiness. I am not worthy as I am. And so inside the validation, Showing the pictures and that version of yourself. What was it that she wanted? Well, I wanted to feel like I had, I had significance. I wanted to feel like I was lovable. I wanted to feel like I mattered and I wanted, And on some level, I suppose I wanted to prove the people who had devalued me and shamed me. I wanted to prove them wrong. I wanted to somehow prove that I indeed was a valuable, Worthy person. And not only that, But you know, Look at me and all of these amazing environments that I have found my way to and all these doors that have opened for me. Surely I must, I must have some kind of significance or I must have some value to have gained access to all of these things that I, From my understanding and my conditioning, That would mean that I was successful. Yes. And can you hear in that, And this is for the listeners as well, That your life became about proving something that you're not or overcompensating to something. Instead of being prima in the world, Your whole life became about trying to prove something. And so you're not able to be you. You're like the story of your unworthiness is living your choices. Exactly. Wow. Yeah. I mean, That's just in itself so important for everyone to hear because that's what happens. That's what we all get caught in that. And then we call that our life and we think that's just who we are, But then it never gets met. It's never enough, Is it? It's never enough. And feeling back into that version of myself, I just have so much compassion for her and I just want to just wrap my arms around her and look her deeply in the eyes and just let her know how worthy she is that it is her birthright to love herself and to cherish herself and to care for herself. And so basically the awakening that I had, Which was in 2006, What became like a really loud, Loud knock on the door from spirit. And up to that point in my life, I hadn't learned much about intuition. I hadn't learned much about inner guidance. I didn't even really barely know those words. So when this voice, The voice of my soul started speaking more and more loudly, It was really confronting and very, Very confusing. And the guidance was that everything you've built your life around to this point, Which was 30 years to that point, Was based on a grand illusion and that I needed to start and rebuild from the ground up. And that anything that I was holding onto from that time in the past was only anchoring me to samsara or to illusion. And so that was. . . How did that come to you? How did that download come to you? It was coming as inner guidance. So it was coming as inner guidance in my consciousness, Which I had never had before. And I had never had training for accessing your higher self or accessing the wisdom of your soul. I had no training for it, Nor did I have any context for it. So when it started happening, I was like, What's going on? Am I going crazy? This inner guidance is telling me that I need to start from scratch and create a whole new life and to give away all of my possessions because where I'm going, I won't need them. And so the biggest moment of surrender was after that the guidance was coming in stronger and stronger. And at a certain point, I just realized I was like, What do I have to lose? And I was very unhappy. I was very unfulfilled. I knew I wasn't on the right path. I was on the path of trying to live out perhaps one of my parents' dreams or society's dreams or some of my friends' dreams, But it wasn't my purpose in incarnating on this planet. It wasn't why my soul chose to come here. It was far from it. So the turning point moment came when I just realized that I was a yes. I was going to follow the voice of my soul, Even if it did not make sense to anyone except for me. I was going to surrender to my higher calling. Wow. Wow. Okay. So that's a really courageous moment. And that in itself, There's kind of multiple steps that happen that I've started to notice. The moment before you're ready to give it all up comes a moment of insight. It's a flash of insight. And it's actually a moment of humility to go, I can't, Where we're willing to say, I can't do it this way anymore. This isn't working. I don't know what I'm doing. And it's not working. Yeah, Exactly. My plan wasn't working and it was time to align myself with a higher plan for my life, To find and listen and stumble towards the divine plan for my life. Even if I couldn't figure out exactly what it was, Just to take one step towards it was a step in the direction of my destiny. Yes. So can you tell us how did that actually look when you started to give up your possessions? Yeah, It was such an interesting journey, Nikita. So I had accumulated 30 years of possessions. So what I ended up doing was I ended up creating these free markets in a downtown area and laying all my stuff out on blankets and just my rollerblades, My stereo, My shoes, And just saying, You can take it, Just take it. I feel so moved by that. That is so moving to me. And just the level of courage that needs to be summoned to do something like that. I just have so much empathy for that girl, Because the calling was so strong and the pain was equally strong and that was the motivator. I was like, What I'm doing is not working. I've got to start walking and I've got to find something else out. So I had two goals in my walking pilgrimage, Which I ended up walking over 500 kilometers with no possessions, Sleeping outside along the way, Sleeping on back doorsteps of churches, Sleeping on bales of hay, Sleeping on picnic tables. I did. Yeah. So you, Sorry to kind of get inside this. So you literally just, You got rid of your possessions, Physical possessions, And just for the listeners, That's not just getting rid of your physical possessions. That's releasing all the attachments that you had had to who you are with those possessions. That stuff defines me. And you were releasing so much of your identity in that. It was massive. In hindsight, I do feel that I made the right decision. I was releasing and putting old, Old love letters in, Recycling them and I actually took my entire modeling portfolio, Which was the one thing that I felt was my ticket to having some sort of value and some sort of self worth. I took the entire thing and I dropped it in the recycling bin and the entire thing that I've worked so many years and put, You know, These photo shoots, But so much, You know, Love and care. And I actually went and deleted all of my modeling portfolio photos from my family's computer as well. I just, I was, My guidance was clear. Everything start from scratch. And my father, My dear father noticed what I was doing and he went and secretly went back into the hard drive and retrieved the photos because he was like, I know this is important for her now. I'm not going to tell her, But one day, One day it will be important for her to have these photos. So he actually went back and retrieved them. That's such a parent thing to do. Yeah. Thank you, Dad. Thank you, Dad. If you're listening. And so, Um, So there was, I had two, Two pieces of guidance were coming in really, Really strongly from my soul as I was embarking on my, My, My vision quest. One was that I, I wanted to learn how to live off of the land. I wanted to find out if it's possible to live completely from growing your own food and wild crafting food and living out basically in the wilderness. And if you could just live that way, I was like, I'm determined to find out if I can do that. And I went and I had a long journey with that, Which I can share more about the second. The second factor that was guiding me was I knew from what I had read about the lives of saints and sages, Which became something that I I've studied very much the lives of, Of hundreds of saints and sages and masters and mystics from many different cultures. What I knew was that there have been saints and sages on the planet and the strikes a tender chord in my heart. There've been saints and sages on the planet in all cultures throughout history. So I felt to myself, There must be some sages and wisdom keepers on the planet now. And although I didn't have access to them in the world that I was living in at that time, I was like, Spirit guide me, Please guide me to those people so that I can learn and grow and receive the wisdom transmission so that I can find a way. My devotion on my path became to find the way to liberate myself so that I could then support as many other people as possible in liberating themselves as well. Okay, Wow. So share with us. So you begin walking. You don't have much money, I suspect. My guidance was actually to stop using money as part of my sadhana and as part of my sadhana, Meaning my practice. So I gave away what little money I had left and I actually lived moneyless for seven months. So when I was on my walking pilgrimage, I was moneyless also. So I learned very quickly about this underground, This was in 2006. So I learned very quickly about this underground movement, Which is called free culture. There's a large movement where there are people who are dumpster diving or collecting day old things from farmers markets and grocery stores. There are free markets where the entire market is filled with free things. There are free people have homes, Especially in Portland, Oregon and places like that where there are free porches where you can just go to the porch and there's like a whole shop of free things. I would never have found out about this if I hadn't received that guidance to go moneyless. And so I walked for over 500 kilometers. At first it was challenging. I walked from San Marcos, Texas all the way across to Reynosa, Mexico. For anyone who feels like looking that up on a map, It was a long journey. I crossed the border at Reynosa, Mexico on New Year's in 2007. And along the journey, In Texas it was in miles. So the most miles I ever walked in one day was 30. That's a lot. That is a lot. It's a lot. And so the first part of the pilgrimage was challenging because my legs were hurting so much. But then eventually I got used to it and I found my stride. And when it came time like at night, I would just ask Spirit to guide me where to sleep. And I would find somewhere often outside, I would find somewhere that felt really safe. And I feel like I was always protected and always surrounded by angels and guides. And I felt like I was very safe. And the interesting thing is on the walking pilgrimage, I was actually having these incredible Satori moments and these amazing experiences. And I was very, Very joyful. I felt amazing. I was like, Wow, This is working. This is incredible. And then when I arrived at One Town, I met a woman who I would describe as long lost soul family. And she ended up inviting me to her house and we were just downloading with each other for like two days. It was so beautiful. And she introduced me to a whole bunch of people who it was the first time in my life where I was recognized for who I am at soul level. And that is the most rewarding feeling that you can possibly have when you've never had that before. So these one of the people just had tears in his eyes and he was like, Oh my goodness, This new era is here. And I'm so glad you've come and I've missed you. And thank you for showing up. And thank you for coming. Brings tears and just the level of authentic joy that they had and hearing what I was doing, That I was on a walking pilgrimage, That I was following my guidance and that I was going around and meeting different spiritual teachers and sages and going to intentional communities. People were really inspired by the journey. I'm still in touch with some of the people that I met on my walking pilgrimage to this day actually. And so in certain towns, People would invite me into their homes and they would feed me and even give me massage once in a while and just love me up and just be so curious about what I was doing. So I ended up. . . I just want to say before you go on, I'm having a really, Really visceral experience to hearing you speak because it's so moving to me and it's like remembering something that I've always known that we have forgotten. That hearing you speak about in releasing all that material, Possession, The identity, You allowed yourself to start listening once again to the land, To the elements, To spirit, To something deep within you. I'm remembering how we once lived here, The indigenous cultures learning from the plants, From the trees, From nature, Walking through the desert. This is a wisdom that is ingrained in our being that we have disconnected from because of all the stuff that we think is who we are. Wow. I'm so moved by hearing this. Thank you so much. And I feel when I discovered you and your body of work, I felt this profound soul recognition. I was like, Oh my gosh, There she is. Hallelujah. My sister. Amazing. So I feel very similar and I have full chills up my arms and my legs right now as I speak. And one of the things that I really wanted to highlight is this was the first time in my life that people had been able to see me for who I truly was because I had peeled so many layers of the facade or the social masks that we all wear. So by releasing those people were actually able to finally see me for who I truly am. And so it was just such the most meaningful and significant and rewarding experiences that I had ever had up until that time in my life. I was crying tears of joy as I was walking, Crying, Crying, Just elated tears of like, Oh, It all makes sense. You know, And all this, Just these Satori experiences where I felt like my third eye was just spontaneously opening and I was just able to see things in a whole different way. And so from that point, I ended up hitchhiking over 20, 000 miles across Mexico, Canada, And the United States going to, For example, I would go hitchhike thousands of miles to go see Ama. Then I would go hitchhike thousands of miles to go hear different, Different teachers like Sri Ma or these different, These different wisdom holders, Even Jack, Jack Kornfield and A. H. Alma's and all these different teachers. I would go listen to them speak and hitchhike. And then I would hitchhike to the Kundalini yoga, Summer solstice, Sadhana celebration in New Mexico and just hitchhiking all around asking people who are the most inspiring visionary teachers you've ever met in your life. And I would, And then I would go hitchhike and meet them and where are the most inspiring evolutionary communities that you've ever come across. And I would go and go to those communities. I would sometimes go to places like you know, For example, Christ in the desert monastery. I would go do a retreat where I would go do retreats in these different mystical, In these different temples, Tibetan Buddhist temples and ashrams all over the place. And the most amazing thing was that when I would arrive there and let people know what I was doing, That I was guided to live moneyless and that I was hitchhiking everywhere, Dumpster diving and slipping outside and visiting different wisdom holders, People would really embrace me with open arms. And for example, I was the only student in the whole Kundalini yoga, Yoga, Summer solstice, Sadhana celebration to receive a full scholarship. It was such an honor and just so many doors opened up for me at that time. And then eventually it came time to ground down and to settle. And I ended up settling in New Mexico and I met a wonderful mystic teacher who my door, His name is wind boon. And he actually, To this day, He lives out in a debris hut in the Gila wilderness. He became one of my greatest mentors and he taught me how to live off of the land and how to wild craft food. He taught me all about the wild edible plants. He taught me about the stars. He taught me about making, Making bags out of plant fiber. He taught me, He was doing things like making pottery over an open fire, Making water vessels out of all different things. It was just so extraordinary. And he still, To this day, He doesn't interact with society. He doesn't use technology. I don't know if he knows what Facebook is. He doesn't like, He doesn't, He's not interested in talking about it. So he's one of my greatest mentors and he welcomed me in and taught me everything and didn't ask for anything. And so he was the one who empowered me because my guidance, My great guidance was that it's part of my destiny to do long solo retreats either in caves or in the forest. So my friend Wind empowered me on how to do that. So I had the opportunity to do a 20 day solo retreat in his mud hut in Northern New Mexico. So I did a 20 day solo retreat out there. And then the following year I did a 20 day solo retreat in the Gila wilderness, Which for those who haven't heard of the Gila wilderness, It's a huge, Beautiful piece of land that has never been bought or sold in the history of this planet. And you can actually still see arrowheads from when indigenous people used to live there. You can still see pottery shards, You can still see all these artifacts out there because it's dry enough that those things haven't eroded. It's extraordinary. So my, So one of Wind's friends packed up two donkeys and took me deep out into the Gila wilderness. Well, One donk, One donkey had had food and provisions and one donkey we rode and we went deep out into the Gila and he dropped me off in a place in the Gila wilderness where I wouldn't see another person hear another, Hear a voice where there was just nothing but me in the wilderness. And it was like, When I got out there, I was like, This is my destiny. I always knew that I was meant to do this. I always knew it. And it was my destiny because my, My path in this lifetime has been to find my connection, My direct connection to source and to reestablish my direct link to source and to empower and support other people in doing the same. And for people to know that it is our birthright to have direct access to source without the intermediary of a priest or a Lama or a rabbi. We all have that direct access. And I was determined to tune in and find my own way back home to source, To my soul, To my guidance. And so when the 20 days was over in the Gila, I actually, I packed up my backpack and I walked, I walked, I hiked out, I hiked out of the wilderness when I was ready. And then after that, Well, I'll pause there, But there's, There's, There's more, There's more to share after that. I have an amazing question to ask you. And I think it'll help a lot of people listening and it keeps coming to me as I'm listening to you. I'm like, I have to ask you this, I have to ask you this. So in all of this, You know, You speak about it because you did it. You speak about it like it's so possible. You know, You, You, You just faced it and you did it, But let's not deny how much courage this takes, What you have done and what you did now, Because you're still human, Even though you're guided divinely by source, You know, Can you share with me, Like, How did you, What happened with the fear? Because there must have been moments of such fear because what I'm hearing is that you were facing you, You, You came face to face with your mortality as well, To be able to, To like every day, To be able to step out of what we think we need in order to survive this life and come face to face with it and challenge that and question it every single day, You come face to face with death and your mortality. So can you share with us about how you, How you, What happened for you around your relationship with fear around your relationship with death? Yes, Yes, I absolutely can. That's a powerful question. So with regards to being out in the wilderness, When I first started doing my, My solo forest retreats, Cause I started by doing short ones for like a day, Three days. And I started familiarizing myself with the wild animals and developing relationships with the wild animals, Like the bears, For example, I love bears. I'm talking about black bears. The only places I did retreats were in black bear country. They weren't in grizzly bear country, But I developed a really beautiful relationship with the bears and my mentors just explained to me how to interact with the animals, Which is one of the most empowering things that I've ever experienced in my life is learning how to be with the wild animals that are considered dangerous. So I was around so many wild animals out in the wilderness, Wild javelinas, These boars with these sharp teeth. As a matter of fact, Here in Costa Rica, I see them on a regular basis where I live now as well, But different, You know, Bighorn sheep and bears. And surely there was wild cats and bobcats, Mountain lions. They were out there. I didn't ever actually physically see them, But they were there. But I learned something that's very, Something that's deeply held in my own, In my own self-awareness now is when I'm out in the wilderness in a space of peace and in a space of being out there in connection to the unified field and connection with all of life, I really, Really feel safe. I really feel safe. I don't feel that the wild animals would attack me or harm me. That's just something it's, It's a deeply held felt sense inside of me that I'm, I'm in relation, I'm in communication with the animals and I just learned how to interact with them so many times that I don't feel, I don't feel threatened by wild animals now. But the other question around death. So this one it's, You know, To answer that question, I'll answer it really vulnerably and I'll answer it from a very tender space. And that is that in some of these times on my journey, I was just in such a space of surrender and also in so much emotional pain still at that time on my path that I was like, Spirit, I am here following you. If it's my time to go, I trust that. And now the way that I would phrase that at this point is very different because I am here on this planet, A hundred percent committed to being in service. And I, I feel very deeply now that I will be on this planet for a long time. I feel that Spirit has poured a lot into me and has invested a lot into me and that I will be here on service for, I believe I'll have a long, A long life. But at that time I was just in such a tender place. I was just offering it all up to God and just trusting, Putting my, Putting my life in God's hands. And yeah, So really that's the ultimate freedom. That's the point of liberation because you know, So much of human suffering comes from our fear of death, From our fear of, Of any version of death, The ultimate death, Which no one really knows what that is by the way. No one really knows what happens when we pass over. And, And when you remove that fear and you're in full acceptance and at peace with, It could be today, It could be tomorrow, It could be now. What that opens up in your relationship to life is everything. And there's a couple of pieces that I felt really called to share as well, Which is, I guess the biggest piece is as I was, Well, I didn't mention a couple of, A couple of details from the journey. One of them was that I ended up shaving my head and joining a Buddhist meditation community for, For a while and doing a lot of, A lot of spiritual practices and meditation and Qigong and a lot of different spiritual practices. But during that, So I was living basically like a self-directed renunciant path for about four or five years. But during that time, What feels really important to share, I was, I was studying different scriptures, Studying the world's wisdom traditions. And during that time, What I didn't realize for part of that section of my journey was that I was on some level of spiritual bypass. And I hadn't, I hadn't actually done some of the deeper work of the emotional healing and the emotional integration, Which is completely, You know, A necessary inextricable ingredient. If, If someone is called into full full leadership or heart guided leadership, Heart guided entrepreneurship, Which is the path that I'm on now, It's an inextricable component to that journey is doing the deep healing work necessary to come into the highest level of alignment and concurrency that we can so that we can serve from a, From a clear space. So when I received the call to come back into busy urban life, That was in late 2012. And I was, I was actually quite hesitant to come back into the busy urban life. I was guided to come back to Los Angeles and I was like, Wow, I can't believe this is happening. I couldn't, I was like, This is the last thing I would ever expected. You know, At that point I still had, My hair was just growing out from being shaved. I was, You know, I was still so in, In, You know, Internally focused, Focused on my relationship with spirit all the time. And I had grown to love that lifestyle of being out in New Mexico and being so close to nature. And so when I was guided to come back into busy urban life and start studying leadership and coaching and entrepreneurship, Well, The guidance was really strong. So I followed it. And since that time in 2012, I've been on that path of first studying leadership and entrepreneurship and coaching and then eventually becoming a guide. But the one piece that I want to highlight is what I personally feel is it's so important to emphasize is there came a time in my life a few years ago where it became really clear that in order to be able to serve at the level that I feel so passionate about doing, I needed to first go and I ended up joining a healing school program for a year and doing the deep, Deep emotional healing and integration work. I joined a school called the Luminous Awareness Institute, Which is a wonderful school. And that after I finished that school, My life started working at a level that it had never worked out before. Yes, I'm so grateful that you brought that up because I think, I mean, I agree completely. There's these, You know, We hit, We can hit certain points of awakening and liberation on a spiritual realm. But at the end of the day, We are, We're human. And the ultimate liberation is can we be human and free? And can we can we speak from that place of liberation in human form? That's, I often have these moments, I have so many, You know, I've had so many moments of such complete liberation and freedom. And then, And you know, And I'll go, Well, Gosh, Why would I want to leave here? Like, Why can't I just go and sit in the rainforest and just be with the trees? Like, I they know, The trees know how to be, I'm happy here. But I always hear the same guidance. Nikki, It is your work to go back into the marketplace. And your work is to be in the marketplace. And that's what I call it. That's what I call life is the marketplace. We go back in and we have to bump up against each other. And that's really where the work begins. Like how much freedom can we be in and speak from while we're in the marketplace? Yeah, Absolutely. Yeah, That that's feels very similar to my to my own path again, As well. And so going to going to the Healing School was such an important it was such an important experience and just having the opportunity actually to cry all of those tears that I had been carrying around for so long. And to be witnessed by where there was a cohort of 100 other students in the Healing School, And they would witness me in my most vulnerable, Terrified, You know, Speaking about, You know, Anxiety or fear, I would be witnessed in certain places inside of myself that hadn't seen the light of day in like over 30 years, Like there was parts of me that would surface in that safe container that literally I had I had tucked away for decades. And I remember moments where I would be sitting with my pod because we were all broken up into these groups called pods. And they would be witnessing me talking about something with extremely, Deeply, Deeply vulnerable. And there were moments where there was a part of me, A certain part of me a very vulnerable part that would say to me that it would it would rather die than be witnessed in that much terror, And in that much fear and in that much vulnerability. And it was so it was certainly real survival energies coming up when you know, I was first letting myself be witnessed in those same places that had catalyzed me to spend 10 years of my life self sedating, You know, 10 years of my life self sedating, There's something in there that obviously needs to be unpacked, You know, Eventually, That's why I wanted to start by asking what was in there at the beginning of my book, Because I have a very similar path, I went down addiction, And I was I was lost in addiction heavily in addiction for a decade of my life. And I got clean at 20. And, And that's young, But I really was on death's door. And I write in the book, You know, And I say really clearly, It wasn't the drugs or the bulimia or the alcohol that was going to kill me. It was the absolute crippling low self worth. That was what was killing my soul. And, And, You know, That is the point that is so important to capture, Because eventually, That is the part that we need to come back to, And to dive deep enough to be with, You know, And when you talk about the deep that deeper work, It's how much can we, How much can we be with the shame? How much can we be with the parts of ourselves, The human reactions and experiences within ourselves, And to be there with compassion, And love and to allow ourselves to be witnessed in that place. Because when we can, It's hard work, But when we can, That changes you forever. And it changes the way that we can be with each other somehow, If we can be with our own shame, Then it gives me the capacity to be with you while you're in yours. 100% 100% Yeah, It sounds, It sounds like it could be easy. And it's extraordinary how hard it is. It's like it can be some of the heart, Especially when you're in the middle of it. And you can't see you know, You can't see the light at the end of the tunnel. And you're just deeply entrenched in the shame and like finding yourself love in those moments. So to circle back to something I shared about the finding myself love, The conditioning and the imprinting in my consciousness was so thick, It was it was really fascinating to unpack it. So the process of the process of unpacking that the process of unpacking that it was quite a quite, Quite a journey. And so I ended up doing a plant spirit medicine ceremony, Which by working with the sacred plants, They were able to kind of go inside of my consciousness and whisper inside of me messages that showed me how lovable I was how worthy I was and it was like the plant spirit medicines were shining a spotlight on different beautiful moments in my life where I had been on my knees offering my life to spirit or shining the light on just showing me my devotion showing me my courage showing me my commitment. And it was because the conditioning and the imprinting were so they were so thick. The only thing that worked for me to get through that was the plant spirit medicine. And I was in a ceremony with a bunch of incredible people who were reflecting back to me my worth my beauty, My value, My gifts, Reflecting to me that I'm an Oracle that I'm a channel and I was it was so it was such an interesting experience because in that moment, There was a part of me that was saying, Wait a second, You mean, I've been carrying the story for 37 freaking years, And it's never for one second been true. Like, It just is so mind boggling, You know, It was really it really required a lot for me to get around that, To wrap my mind around that how could that be? This has been my reality for 37 years, And you're telling me that I'm actually a beautiful soul, That I'm actually here as a light on this planet. What? What? And it was just so wrapping my mind around that really took some doing and was the only thing that could chip away that deeply was the plant spirit medicine because, You know, I could have gone to counseling and therapy for 10 years and it still wouldn't have gone through into that those depths of my psyche in the way that the plant spirit medicine does. So it's not for everyone, Obviously, But it's, It was one of the biggest catalysts, It was the catalyst that finally helped me find myself love that plus the integration, And not plus the the sacred reflections of all the other people who were in that container with me just reflecting back who I actually am. And what a you know, What a mind boggling experience to really let that land for you, That the basically what we internalized, You know, The painful projections of, Of hurt people, That we internalize as something is wrong with me. And however long we carry that, And my prayer is that people won't have to carry it as long these days. And I believe that, You know, It's a powerful time on the planet right now, Time of great awakening and great healing. And we're all here as mirrors for each other. And my prayers, Perhaps someone will hear this podcast, And it will, It will help them and benefit them to really question any limiting stories or imprints they may have taken on in childhood and just really question whether whether those are 100% accurate, Or maybe, Maybe it's a good opportunity to reevaluate that. Yes, I mean, That is literally what my entire book is about. It's, You know, I speak about how, You know, Well, We're like a frog in a well, But we don't know that we're in the well, We think that's our world. But the well is the story that has defined and we have been attached and identified with of who we think we are. And until, You know, We can't see the wolves, We just think that's our world. And that's reality. And, You know, We are in this extraordinary time now where there is, You know, Sages and, And, And, You know, Wisdom teachers were talking about this decades and decades ago, They were talking about this time that we're living in now. And what comes with awakening is a form is a phase of destruction. First, The destruction, Something must die, Something needs to dissolve, Something needs to be challenged, The blind spots need to be shaken up. So it's not an easy, Comfortable journey. But my goodness, You know, And nobody can live it for you. That's the, That's the important part. There's nothing that you and I can say, That will still deny someone from having to have the lived experience of, Of living through their process and waking up. Exactly. Let's hope we can inspire them and give them courage and give them identification. They're not alone. But the, And this is the part that I think is the gift. You have to be the one that does it. You are the only one that has the power to live through it yourself and wake up yourself. And that's, That that in itself is so empowering. And that challenges the whole conditioning anyway, That something out there is more powerful than you are. And so, Yeah, I mean, I just, I'm just so moved. And there's so much in your story and not just your story, In your courage and your commitment to listening to something greater and living that. You know, Pre-made, This has been a gift that's on so many levels to everybody that's going to listen to this. There's so many things in here that, That are just going to be light bulbs and light bulbs. So I guess what the one thing I want to finish off by asking you is where you are now, Having lived this, What is your vision? What is your vision in the world? I truly believe that this, Although it seems very dynamic and very tumultuous at the surface level for sure, I actually believe that it's falling apart so that it can fall back together. And when, You know, As I've been having conversations with so many soul guided leaders and entrepreneurs and visionaries, What I've heard from so many people is that they're thriving at the highest level of their lives right now. And it's like the more that we do the deep inner work to bring ourselves into integrity and into congruency, To be able to serve our sacred work. I feel like these times are actually, It's so many old systems and structures that weren't serving are falling down rapidly. And there's this whole new field that we get to plant the seeds that we've been holding and guarding with so much devotion for so many years. We get to plant those seeds of our soul gifts and our Dharma and our sacred work. We get to plant those seeds in the fertile soils. And it's almost like I live in Costa Rica now. It's a great metaphor when you plant seeds in the soils here in Costa Rica and you know, It's the rain forest where I live and those seeds are going to grow very, Very quickly and they're going to be rich and beautiful. It's like, So it's a great metaphor for what's happening right now on the planet. It's like there's this open field. So many of us that chose to be here at these times, We have these seeds we've been holding onto, Protecting and taking such good care of. And it's time to plant those seeds and let them nourish and uplift so many other people as well. I love you. I just do. I'm so grateful that we were brought into each other's worlds and I'm extremely moved by meeting you and knowing you and hearing your journey. Yeah, I just thank you. Thank you so much for your service and for your gift in the world and for being such a stand for something so much greater. It's really beautiful. Thank you so much, Prima, For sharing your story with us. Thank you, Nikki. I love you too. And I'm so, So grateful for the work you're doing. You're such an inspiration to myself and to so many people. So deeply honoring you for shining your light so brightly. And thank you to everyone listening and would love to hear from you. If you felt inspired, Feel free to reach out to me. And just so, So grateful for this opportunity to share. Thank you so much. Thank you. Thank you.