People,
Welcome to this unique opportunity we give ourselves to stop the rush,
Hold hands and walk the path together,
Not just as individuals but also as a united consciousness that is asking and answering and using the tension between the question and the answer to grow.
And we are gathered here in the middle of our journey titled Graceful Relationships,
Where we share our questions and wonders about what brings us together,
What pulls us apart,
What are the forces playing in that scene called relationships.
So this is your opportunity to contribute by sharing your question,
Sharing your curiosity,
Your longing for the truth.
And in the second half of the meeting we'll follow the song of Mahamudra to remind ourselves that relationships are an illusion.
So who wants to be the first one?
We have all kinds of audiences here on Insight Timer,
In the real world we have representatives of the Yanagir generations,
So you are all invited to jump in.
There is always someone who is asking the first question,
So why don't that person be you this time?
In English.
What is the point of relationships?
What is the point of relationships?
So important about it.
What is so important about it?
I mean,
Think about it.
Relationship is the context through which we meet life.
There is me and there is life.
And we have a relationship.
As long as there is this duality,
Yes?
Me separated from life,
So we are negotiating.
Everything is in the context of relationship.
Interactions.
Your very existence is in the context of having a relationship with life.
Right?
It doesn't matter if you have a partner or not.
It's much bigger than just having a relationship with some specific person.
Our lives is in that context.
As long as we experience our individuality separated from the world,
Which in the second half we'll remind ourselves is an illusion.
But so you're asking why is it so important?
Because that's the scene in which you play.
There is no other scene.
Everything is in the context of relationship.
So,
Of course,
Learning how and gaining the tools to turn that scene into a healthy,
Harmonious environment is crucial because it affects every aspect of your life.
Right?
But I'm guessing you're asking about the specific aspect of relationship between you and your partner,
Right?
Why is that important?
Well,
You can look at it in different levels.
You know,
First of all,
We are social animals.
We are not designed to live alone,
Even though it's a pandemic in the Western world.
We are,
By design,
Built to have relationships.
This is how we heal our thirst.
Not heal,
But?
Quench.
Quench our thirst.
Quench our thirst.
God.
Right?
That's why,
I mean,
Think about it.
Most of the time,
I mean,
I don't want to put numbers,
But in the vast majority of cases,
People get together because they are thirsty,
Because they have a sense of lack and need,
And they believe that through relationships,
They can quench that thirst.
Right?
So they create some kind of an agreement with the partner that promises to deliver whatever merchandise I feel I don't have enough of.
It doesn't matter if it's a sense of security,
It's entertainment,
It's love,
Whatever I feel I don't have enough,
My partner is supposed to be my supplier.
Correct?
So people get together,
Making sure that their warehouse keeps receiving the goods.
And if the supplier fails to do that,
Or he starts delivering rotten goods,
They fire that supplier,
They're looking for some supplier with more fresh merchandise.
This is why we are,
In most cases,
Craving for relationships,
Hoping that it will fill that hole that we feel inside.
So the next question would be,
Does an awakened consciousness need a relationship?
Because everything we do here is in reference to an awakened consciousness,
Right?
Can an awakened consciousness be fulfilled without a relationship?
The answer is definitely,
Because it doesn't need anything.
That's the whole point.
It's not driven by need.
So an awakened person doesn't have relationships,
He must be alone,
No?
The whole point of being awake is that you don't have to do anything,
Or to refrain from anything.
You can be whatever is accurate at any given time.
Does this answer the question?
If relationships are like capitalism,
It's a very bleak look at the whole problem.
Yeah.
We need to put it on the table.
It's saying it's like capitalism and it's bleak.
Yeah.
I mean,
Think about your relationships in the past.
Of course,
It started because you fell in love,
There was infatuation,
Right?
It's like being on drugs.
And there is a survival reason for that mechanism.
It's not by chance,
It's not a coincidence.
Because if we are completely in our senses,
There is no way we would put down our guards and allow somebody to get so close and intimate.
So it's supposed to blind us.
And this is what it does,
Infatuation blinds us.
And then after two weeks or two months or two years,
If you're really lucky,
The drug wears off and you actually see the person who's now in front of you,
Which is a bit different than what you had in mind,
But you're stuck.
And now there is the negotiation.
Okay,
But you promised me this,
You promised me that.
I will give you this if you give me that,
Right?
This is usually what brings people together and keeps them together.
It's not love,
It's fear.
Fear of losing what I have or fear of not getting what I believe I still need.
This is the reality of it.
You don't meet many people that are truly,
Unconditionally love someone without putting conditions on their relationships.
I will love you but A,
B and C.
So it doesn't mean that other type of relationship is not possible.
It's definitely possible,
But it starts with you being completely honest about what drives you to find a relationship and to sustain a relationship.
Is it love or is it fear?
Is it a sense of lack and need and the belief that only when I get that,
Then I will be happy?
Fulfilled?
Then you know you're driven by fear.
How do you know when you're not driven by fear and there's only love there,
Unconditionally?
Search inside and see if physically,
When you are in the company of your partner,
You are just blossoming.
Energy flows from inside out.
There is no contraction blocking that flow.
Physically,
You don't feel that I don't love you because you are A,
B and C.
Or because you carry the promise to be A,
B or C.
I love you because I love you.
Because you are.
I love you because you are.
More questions?
You've got some comments.
Ava is saying just like we breathe with the trees,
We are in relationship with everything.
Correct.
And relationships bring creation and life.
It does.
AJ is asking,
Aren't relationships mirrors to us,
Good and bad?
Yeah,
Definitely.
Any relationship is an opportunity to learn about yourself because you see yourself reflected in that other person's eyes.
So usually in any interaction like that,
You can learn something about yourself.
The only problem is that usually when you meet yourself in other people's eyes,
You meet a blurry image because it's not a clear image.
It's tinted with their own impressions,
Their own past judgments,
Their own ego,
Their own expectations,
Their own conditions about you.
So it's very rare to find someone that the reflection that you see is pure and there's only one ego there,
Yours.
That's a relationship you can have with your spiritual master.
Or if you're lucky enough to find somebody that unconditionally loves you.
It's rare.
And AJ is also asking,
How about relationships with nature or the universe?
Any type of interaction where there is me versus what I meet.
That's a relationship.
There is two.
Yes,
It could be even me and my body,
Me and my thoughts.
There is me versus something.
Then there is a relationship.
And immediately there is a condition there.
When will I be happy?
When I will learn how to control my thoughts.
Have you ever met that belief?
Especially on the spiritual path.
What did I say?
Especially on the spiritual path.
When will I be happy?
When I'll be able to chase all my thoughts away and there is the only blank,
Clear sheet.
And there are no more clouds in the sky.
Then I will be enlightened.
But in the meantime,
I have this issue of thoughts that I need to do.
I need to deal my thoughts.
You see the duality there.
Sana is asking the relationship with the self.
How can that be an illusion?
Yeah,
Me and my self.
You have to realize that self cannot be owned by anything.
Self is the manifestation of non-dualism.
That's what we call self.
Okay,
That's the code word for a lack of better word.
Because there is no one word that can wrap it up.
But the essence of the world,
The word self is non-duality.
So there is no me versus self.
The self is not mine.
When I'm experiencing self,
There is no I-ness,
Me,
Anymore.
There is only oneness being manifested through what I used to be referring to as me.
Sounds a bit philosophical?
Philosophical?
Hmm?
What else?
So Sana'a,
See if you can meet the non-duality aspect in you.
And then melt into that until there is no two anymore.
We'll dedicate the second half of this meeting to do that.
Hmm?
What else?
What is jealousy?
What's the purpose of jealousy?
Why does that exist in relationships?
Jealousy is me chasing an image,
A promise of happiness.
I believe that if I will get that,
The image that I have in my head,
I will be happy.
I will be complete.
I will be fulfilled.
I think that's envy,
What you're describing.
Same,
Same.
No,
Jealousy is the opposite.
Losing what you think you own.
No,
I see somebody,
Let's say I'm single,
Yeah?
And I'm looking at this couple who are loving and hugging.
Yeah,
That's envious.
That's envious?
Yeah.
Okay,
So what is jealousy?
Jealousy is having something and then fearing losing it.
I'm not jealous if this guy has a bigger car than mine?
No.
That's envy?
Yeah.
So I've lived 58 years without knowing that.
So jealousy is?
So you say it's fear.
Either one is fear.
One is the fear of losing what you think you have,
And the other one is fearing not getting what you think you need,
Right?
So one is envy and one is jealousy.
Okay.
So jealousy is losing what I think I have.
Yes.
Okay.
Same.
I have this image that without what I have that is mine,
Without it I cannot be complete.
Yes?
Yeah.
And I'm careful that life will not take it away from me.
That is fear.
And the opposite fear,
The complementary fear,
Is the fear of not getting what I believe I need.
I don't have,
But without it I cannot be complete,
Cannot be happy.
So both are the two sides of the same coin.
Why do we have it?
Because we don't know who we are.
That's why.
How to overcome jealousy and?
Envy.
Envy.
Self-knowledge.
You know who you are.
You know how complete and magnificent you already are,
As you are.
You know yourself to be perfect.
Then these will drop.
Adding self-knowledge is the cure.
And again,
It's not because of your talents.
It's not because of how beautiful you are.
It's not because of your property or whatever.
It's not because of your genes or your parents.
It's not because of your story.
It's because you are a divine expression of perfection.
Wake up to know yourself,
The nature of the self.
These will drop.
They will lose their meaning.
How can perfection crave?
How can wholeness protect itself against life?
Life is an expression of wholeness.
How can wholeness protect itself?
For what reason?
What is it protecting?
Who is protecting it?
AJ is asking,
What's the difference between awakening and enlightenment?
Both are code words.
Just because of lack of better words.
Seems to me they both mean the same thing.
Yeah.
To awaken to your true nature is what we're here to do.
And we call it awakening because it's not something that you can gain.
It's not something that is a reward at the end of your efforts.
It's not something that you can,
You know,
It's not a trophy.
You just wake up from a dream.
That's it.
From an illusion.
That's why the Buddha,
The name,
The Buddha,
This guy,
Is literally translated to the awakened one.
The one who was awakened,
As opposed to the rest of us who are still sleeping.
So wake up.
Are we asleep the moment we're born?
Are we asleep?
Are we asleep the moment we are born?
It really depends.
Some kids come to this world oblivious.
You know,
There is this urban legend,
You know,
That just before you come,
The angel comes and touches you here.
And then you forget everything.
It's just so that you can learn it again throughout your life.
And yet there are those who really hold on to their memory and they don't want to forget.
So he touched them again here.
So then if you see people with this,
You know,
They have a line here.
A dimple,
Chin dimple.
Yeah.
Then,
You know,
They really hold on to that memory.
So usually we just forget and it takes a lifetime to remember.
Some kids maintain a very strong memory.
I know personally of one who's sitting here in front of me.
He is spending his life trying to forget instead of trying to remember.
What else?
Barbara said,
I attempted to do the homework from last week.
I tried to meet my two sisters with freshness,
Curiosity,
No preconceived expectations or roles.
It was a wonderful,
Playful,
Refreshing,
Revealing time with them.
Thank you.
Wow.
Fantastic.
You see how precious homework is.
I cannot emphasize that enough.
Don't just come here for an hour.
Of course,
It's much better than not coming at all,
But use this as an opportunity to ignite your whole week.
You know,
And use that week to practice what we discuss,
You know,
Implement it.
It's a wonderful,
Wonderful experience.
Good,
Good.
What else?
If relationships come from,
Like between people,
Come from a place of feel,
Of wanting something because you want to be happy.
I mean,
If you like,
If you don't get it,
You won't be happy.
Would a person or consciousness that is awakened seek out relationships?
So he's asking if we usually seek relationships because of lack and need,
Would an awakened consciousness seek relationship?
The answer is no.
The very essence of an awakened consciousness is the cease of seeking.
Cessation of seeking.
Because you have to,
You have to realize that we seek because we lack.
It doesn't matter if you seek fame or fortune or glory or love or affection or affirmation.
It doesn't matter what drives you,
But you seek it because you don't feel you have it.
So you go out there and you demand life to provide it.
An awakened consciousness is not driven by lack anymore.
It's realized as bounty.
Everything is already there.
So why would I run out and look for something?
I am that.
I am that.
So if anything is just me inviting everyone,
Come,
If you're thirsty,
Come and drink.
I am the fountain.
The fountain cannot be thirsty.
I am the water.
So please,
How do you say,
What's the word?
Quench.
Unquench yourself.
Unquench yourself.
Uh.
Is that it?
Unquench yourself.
Ah,
Okay.
You get the point.
Is the practice of not seeking part of the path to awaken?
There are spiritual paths that you practice the cessation of seeking.
It's like,
You know,
Training your whole system to a state of enlightenment.
So like,
Fake it until you make it,
Sort of thing.
But it doesn't matter which practice you choose to apply.
The bottom line is that you know you have arrived when you wake up to realize you never left.
Until that moment,
You are still striving,
Trying to reach the goal.
But when you wake up to realize,
Ah,
I am that.
I was always that.
It's not something that I achieved.
I started as wholeness.
I am wholeness.
That's it.
There's nowhere to go.
There's nothing to do.
So,
What else?
AJ says,
Barbara,
I'm envious.
AJ,
You cannot miss our meeting.
I don't allow it.
You have to be here.
Pandra's asking,
Are parents supposed to love us unconditionally?
Of course not.
You know that.
What is supposed?
It's a condition that you put on your love.
You are supposed to A,
B,
And C.
What?
How?
Who says who?
Once you bring the supposed to a relationship,
It's not unconditional anymore.
Not because of your parents,
Because of you.
You see that?
Don't put conditions on your love.
When you put conditions on your love,
You cannot express your true nature.
And you always feel that you are missing the point.
Even if you won the lottery and you find a partner that loves you unconditionally,
But your love is conditioned,
You still would feel that,
I guarantee.
So,
If you find yourself putting conditions on your love,
Be aware of it.
And if you truly want to be free,
Drop it.
I don't love you because A,
B,
And C.
I love you.
This is my nature.
I can't help it.
Got nothing to do with you.
What else?
We have to leave some time for Tilopa.
So,
We are following a song.
Okay,
So one last question before we go there.
AG is asking,
Can you please differentiate universal love and our version of love?
When you refer to our,
You mean when the universe and me are not one and the same.
I guess.
When it's not one and the same,
When I feel separated,
Then it's inevitable that I will be driven by fear.
Think about a wave that only remembers himself.
He is oblivious to the ocean.
He can only focus on his temporary existence.
Of course,
The wave feels lack because he can only rely on his own limited resources,
Right?
Everything seems so big and threatening,
And the wave has only so much energy to deal with that.
And he sees that,
You know,
The shore is coming.
He's realizing that his own existence is temporary.
So,
We have so much to hold on to and try to achieve before I'm crashing to the shore.
Correct?
Everything is in the context of lack and need when I am separated.
But now think about the same wave when it remembers the ocean.
When it realizes that that separated I is just an illusion,
There is no wave.
They're all oceanic expressions.
Temporary oceanic expressions.
Now go back and ask yourself,
How would that wave wave conduct relationships when it remembers the ocean?
Do you see what I'm saying?
Good.
So,
We have to give some time for Tilopa.
So,
We're following a song that is written 800 years ago by a teacher called Tilopa,
To his beloved disciple Niropa,
Trying to express what he experienced as an enlightened consciousness.
Realizing that it's beyond words,
He's singing it because there is no other way to express it.
So,
We are in the fourth chapter today,
And it goes like this.
AJ said waves and oceans would be a good book title.
It just so happens that the next book is called When the Wave Remembers the Ocean.
It's coming.
It's in the pipeline.
If you know a good publisher,
Contact me.
Am I reading or you?
I can read.
Just to remind you that the song of Mahamudra is not only about the meaning of the words,
But it carries a certain energy.
Try to stay open to that energy.
Feel that vibration.
It's an invitation carried by a very unique vibration.
Chapter 4.
Be Like a Hollow Bamboo The song continues.
Do not with the body but relax.
Shut firm the mouth and silent remain.
Empty your mind and think of not.
Like a hollow bamboo,
Rest at ease with your body.
Giving not nor taking,
Put your mind at rest.
Mahamudra is like a mind that clings to not,
Thus practicing in time you will reach Buddhahood.
So,
You see what Tilopa is doing here?
He's taking everything that we've discussed this hour and throw it to the garbage.
I've read this chapter many times and the only conclusion I can come to is he's playing with his disciple.
It's almost cynical.
This chapter is almost cynical.
I would read it like this.
Yeah,
Yeah.
Do not with your body and relax.
Shut firm your mouth and silent remain.
Yeah,
Definitely.
Empty your mind.
Yeah,
Yeah.
And think of not.
That will help you.
You go do that.
Let's see if we can follow his invitation.
Invitation.
And again,
Don't just cling to the meaning of the words.
So,
Do not.
Here he's actually moving from describing what he experiences to guidance of how to achieve it.
So,
It's the first time he's actually giving him practical guidance and it goes like this.
Do not with the body but relax.
So,
This is important.
We are programmed to believe that through effort we can achieve what we need,
What we want.
Hard work,
Dedication,
Commitment will get us there,
Right?
And Tilopa says no.
This is not something you can attain because of your efforts.
Nothing you can do physically can get you there.
So,
Relax.
Shut firm your mouth and silent remain.
No need to talk about it.
No need to try to explain or to express this.
Not to yourself,
Not to anybody else.
Shut up already.
Silent remain.
Don't be afraid of silence.
Especially these days.
Think about it.
That was written 800 years ago.
Now we are attacked by a constant stream of information and we don't know how to keep silent anymore.
We don't know that.
We've never did that.
We've been surrounded by constant noise since we came to this planet.
Haven't we?
Two minutes of silence drives us crazy.
I see the younger people here already scratching themselves.
Silent remain.
Don't be afraid of silence.
Make it your best partner.
Feel at home.
You are silence.
You cannot continue to be afraid of silence if you truly are honest in your quest.
That's why a silent retreat is so important.
You know,
It's like that vacation that we take from ourselves and from the constant noise.
Empty your mind and think of not.
What does it mean think of not?
What is thinking of not?
How can you think of not?
It's a paradox.
How can you think of not?
A thought has no substance.
It's just endless stream of images.
Like clouds in the sky.
These images steal your attention.
But if you become a lover of silence,
You let go of that hypnotic movement and you focus on the skies,
On what doesn't change,
What hides behind the change,
Behind the noise.
And this is beautiful,
Isn't it?
Like a hollow bamboo.
Rest at ease with your body.
Like a hollow bamboo.
What does it mean?
We are so full of ourselves.
We are so full of ourselves.
The story we cling to,
False identifications,
All the fear,
The wants and needs,
The lack.
We are so full.
It's impossible to penetrate.
It's impossible to play through us.
Think about a flute that is completely clogged.
How can you play music through that flute?
So he's saying for God to be able to play through you,
You need to be emptying yourself like a bamboo.
Only then the divine can play through you.
Giving and not taking.
Put your mind at rest.
It's not about me versus the world and having that commercial relationship that we referred to in the beginning of this discussion.
I give,
I take,
And there is always this accountant that is running the books,
Making sure that I don't give more than I take,
Otherwise there will be overdraft.
So no,
No,
It's not about that,
He's saying at all.
It's not about you giving or taking.
Put your mind at rest.
Truly rest for once.
Let go of that idea that life owes you something.
Or the other way,
That you need to protect the little that you have from life,
Against life.
Otherwise you'll be empty,
You'll be lost.
It's not about that at all.
And then he finishes with this.
Mahamudra is like a mind that clings to nought.
That one is a paradox.
That word nought keeps repeating again and again.
When my son was 10 years old,
He gave a speech about that nought,
That nothingness.
It's incredible what little kids can remember.
Who were you?
What were you before conceptualizing your life?
It's literally called conception.
Wow.
Isn't that amazing?
Conceptualizing your life,
This and that.
Pure consciousness that is not bounded by conceptions,
Concepts,
Ideas.
I versus the world.
I want,
I need,
What will I gain out of that?
Clinging to nought is bringing back the quality of pure consciousness that is not attached to any idea,
Any concept of anything.
That is the manifestation of innocence.
And then he says,
Just practice in time,
You will reach buddhahood.
So go try it,
Practice.
But I would say this,
As long as you believe you haven't arrived,
You will never arrive.
As long as you believe there is still work for you to do,
There will be a lot of work for you to do.
As long as you believe you have to grow,
You have to mature,
You have to learn this and that,
It's going to take a lot of effort.
I'm not sure I can,
I'm not sure I'm worthy.
I guarantee you create a gap that is unbridgeable.
Awakening is not something that you find at the end of the rainbow.
Awakening is realizing that you are the rainbow.
What are you saying?
The mind that clings to nought,
It reminds me of what you say about the last desire.
Do you know what Karl is talking about?
No,
They don't,
Because it's in the Wave and Ocean book.
All right.
No,
But we spoke about it in many occasions.
You know,
We are driven by desires,
We are driven by I want,
And on the path we are encouraged to drop them,
Drop the I that wants this or that.
But we said it's okay to have one last remaining want that drives you all the way to the edge of the cliff.
That is,
I want to be free,
Because before we learn how to fly,
We need to reach the edge of that cliff.
If that I want is not strong enough in you,
It's very difficult to get there.
So practicing,
Following the recommendation of Tilopa,
Yeah,
Yeah,
Do that,
Practice that.
But know that at the edge of a cliff,
Your want will not help you.
The ego cannot commit suicide.
I want to be free,
There is still I that wants,
And as long as there's I that wants,
There's ego there,
Playing in you.
At the edge of a cliff,
There is surrender.
When you lose the hope that anything you can do will help you manifest that.
It's not about you doing anything.
It's about you surrendering to your true nature.
And Barber says he started the song with beyond all words and symbols,
And so that seems like not to me,
To her.
Yeah,
Yeah,
Like we use the word concept today.
Words and symbols are all concepts.
Trying to conceptualize our life and gain some meaning out of it.
Control,
A sense of control.
Good,
More questions?
Live audience?
If we will never reach awakening while we still believe that there is something that we have to learn or something that we have to do,
Why are we here?
What are we doing now?
Now we are asking and answering in a circle.
So ask the question again.
What is the point of us sitting down and learning about spiritual awakening and about the path if to reach awakening you need to forget that there's something that you still need to learn or something that you still need to do?
Isn't that incredible?
Like realizing that the thing that I want the most I can do nothing about.
I remember then when I first realized that it was like having somebody slapping my face.
Physically,
It was painful.
What do you mean?
Nothing that I can do will get me there?
So what's the point?
Why am I sitting for meditation?
Why am I refraining from eating meat?
Why am I following this guru,
This path?
What's the point?
Right?
I was seriously insulted.
I felt deceived.
What's the point?
My ego was burning in me.
Are you kidding?
I can't do anything about it?
Everything I do takes me away from it?
Giving,
Not.
No taking.
Put your mind at rest.
It was like.
.
.
For me,
It was like.
.
.
Seriously.
Aho,
Niranjana.
Yeah.
What's the point?
There's no point.
Let go of the idea there is a point.
There's zero point.
Just relax.
And in that positive moment.
.
.
We'll give it a rest.
Thank you for your time,
Your attention,
Your beautiful questions.
Thank you for the live audience.
It was a pleasure.
You're welcome every week to go with us.
And Saturday,
We're going to meet at 12 to have an open Q&A.
Bring your beautiful questions and your friends.
We can make it a party.
12,
Mountain time in North America.
Yes.
Just to be clear.
Is there any other time?
There's many other sense.
There's a whole world of times.
Bye.
