The Long Out Breath

51:23

51:23

The Long Out Breath

by Burgs & The Art of Meditation

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talks

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Meditation

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In this podcast Burgs discusses how we might develop a new attitude to the global challenges we are now facing and seeks positive and practical solutions in the face of much global uncertainty, at this extraordinary period in history. Within in this Burgs investigates the power that comes to us when we actually embrace the idea of letting go.

Breathing Uncertainty Letting Go Teachings Dharma Nature Responsibility Challenges Balance Consciousness Community Change Cyclical Nature Balance And Harmony Blissful Breathing Environmental Impacts Spiritual Journeys Spirits

Meet your Teacher

Burgs & The Art of Meditation

London, United Kingdom

Meet your Teacher

Burgs & The Art of Meditation

London, United Kingdom

Transcript

Hello and welcome to the first ever Art of Meditation podcast. My name is Andy, I'm a student from the Art of Meditation. I'm with Oli. Hello. I'm here with Hugo. Hello. And he's also a student of a teacher called Burgs. So Hugo, Who is Burgs? Burgs is a meditation teacher. He's been teaching meditation in Europe and Asia for a number of years, 20 years or so, With many thousands of students. He is author of a few books, Which you may have read. Okay, What's your favourite book Hugo? Beyond the Veil, The Autobiography and also The Survival Guide to Staying Conscious, Which is very relevant to what we're facing now. So The Survival Guide to Staying Conscious. Survival Guide to Staying Conscious. Says it all. And where can we find that more? On the Art of Meditation website. The address is www. Theartofmeditation. Org. Check it out. See if you like our vibe. Great. Perfect. So Hugo, You've been practicing with Burgs for a number of years. I think about 10 years now. Right. And what do you find really powerful about Burgs as a teacher? For me, I think the thing that really attracted me was how he brought the ancient teachings to life in a way that was understandable. Originally, I was a bit of a skeptic, I've got to be honest. When I heard about this Burgs in meditation, I thought, Gosh, Yeah, Not really for me. A number of my friends were going on these retreats. And eventually, My friend persuaded me to go and check it out. And I've never looked back. And I think that was the thing is when I met Burgs, It was the way in which he brought these teachings to life. And I could see that actually, They were very, Very practical and very relevant to what we all face as human. And I've got to say, Hugo, I came to Burgs through you. Yes. So it's like quite a word of mouth movement. Very much so. It's always been like that. Yeah. And that was another thing I really liked. Yeah, I just found that the teachings were really authentic. And what I had perhaps thought was a philosophy or a technical theory, I suddenly realized was completely alive within me. And it was totally relevant to what I was going through. And this Dharma that they talked about was actually life. And that life was expressed through me. And Burgs helped me to see that and take it out of my head into an embodied and deeply authentic experience. And I find that as well, That one of Burgs' books actually is called Living Dharma. Yeah. And that's what it's all about. It's kind of so many other ways of engaging in meditation. You're reading books, It can be very head-based. And for me, Burgs brings it down into the heart. It's a living expression of meditation. And I think that people don't really anticipate that or realize that. But then over the years, All the students that I've seen come on retreat, You suddenly see people realizing that for themselves and then expressing this alive practice that isn't something that you read in books. It's something much deeper and more inspiring than that. And it goes beyond meditation, Doesn't it? Because you see people making big changes in their lives, Which has nothing to do with meditation, But it's actually living a more authentic, A more true life to themselves. So this is quite exciting actually, Because for the first time, Burgs is going to be publishing this podcast series, Which is all about how to stay conscious in the modern world. And particularly these challenges, Huge challenges we're currently facing as humans. What's this series all about to you? Yeah, This series to me, I think, As you just said, Invites us to look at the challenges that we face, Perhaps in a different way to how traditionally everybody's thinking about them. And I think some of the notions that are introduced, They're unexpected and quite surprising. But when you actually sit down and think about what he's saying, It's remarkably simple and quite obvious and very inspiring. And I've got a list here of some of the things we're going to be covering over the next weeks and months. So the first is called the long out breath. So we'll say a bit more about what that means in just a minute. The other topics we'll be exploring. The one I'm really looking forward to is we're just being bombarded now with 5G, With Wi-Fi, And it's really hard to really stay conscious within that. So we're going to be looking at those challenges. We're going to be looking at how we can integrate a personal spiritual journey into our families, Into our lives, And into our relationships. And we'll be also looking at a broad look at the discipline of meditation in general. So quite a lot we're covering. That's an exciting stuff. So lots of exciting things to get stuck into. And today we're going to begin with the first of the series, The long out breath. There is a reason that the universe is not in conflict because it maintains its perfect balance. So I'm here with Bergs. Hi Andy, How are you doing? I'm good, Thank you. Right, So let's start. Bergs, What is the long out breath? What's it all about? What is this idea? All right, So you know I spend a lot of time looking at the way various organizations are and movements. There's a lot of movement now, A huge amount of concern at what we're facing, The challenges we're facing, Humanity, The planet, Our economic systems, Our political systems. Everything's creaking, Everything's under pressure, And I'm looking at the way we're pursuing solutions. And everywhere I look I see it in terms of how can we keep this going. Now almost everywhere it's like in terms of how can we keep this progress and growth as a paradigm to continue in spite the fact we can see our planet is creaking under the effects of what we're doing to it. So this notion, The long out breath, Is looking at the fact that the absolute is obvious to us. That everything in nature is cyclic, Everything expands, Contracts, Breathes in, Breathes out. Nothing expands indefinitely and that the gradual contraction of things is part of the natural order. And that having expanded so rapidly and to such an extreme level, Humanity is so complex, Every all of our social structures, Our political structures, Our economic structures, Is so complex that they reach an unsustainable level. We can see it and we're looking at how do we keep this show on the road. And the answer is in decompressing, Breathing out, Allowing things to naturally contract as is the rhythmic cycle of things. And what does that actually look at in terms of bringing about change? Because that's a paradigm shift. A paradigm shift compared to the way that we are instinctively seeking solutions to the problems that we're facing. So that's why I've called it the long out breath because humanity's been through a long period of breathing in, Breathing in, Breathing in. It's so full of breathing in, It's under so much pressure, It doesn't start breathing out soon. Something's going to pop. Great, Well thanks for that intro, Bergs. And I should say also that this was recorded live at the meditation retreat. So it's about 20 minutes of discourse and then we'll come back for a chat afterwards. Great. Let's have a listen. Expansion and contraction is the way of things and it keeps a net balance by being like that. There are three states of being. There is the arising, What we call the standing or the just being and then the passing away and it's a cycle. Like the breath is a cycle. Expansion and contraction is the way of things and it keeps a net balance by being like that. There is a reason that the universe is not in conflict because it maintains its perfect balance. So there's a point in our lives where we've reached a place where we're not going to grow anymore and we are at a standing state. Actually at that point is the point at which we would hopefully get to the place where we stop taking out to be here. And we appreciate the being here and towards the end of the life we give it back. That's a natural cycle. Like I say the Buddha moved like a stick through water and left no mess behind him. The growth of communities, Civilizations, Groups of beings has exactly the same intelligence to it. It grows, It becomes more complex, It forms itself. The cooperation and coherence that it takes to create and develop the world is the same as the world itself. The cooperation and coherence that it takes to create stability comes to a point and at that point it should when virtue pervades then beings delight in the being alive and then give it back. So in the big scheme of things that's how things roll out. You breathe in, There's a point where if you keep breathing in it doesn't feel very comfortable and you keep breathing in you start to do yourself a mischief and if you don't breathe out you go pop. That's the way of things. If you don't breathe out when you need to you hold a tremendous amount of conflict and friction and tension inside you. If you don't let life breathe the way it needs to breathe you live with a tremendous amount of friction and tension within you or life momentarily exists in a state of tension. There's a point where that becomes oppressive and then there is no grounds for that delight in being. That comes naturally to any being that just rests within itself. Well you know you are born into a time where the growth period has been done. You have not had to struggle to create the stability that your life stands upon. You didn't have to work hard just to put bread on the table. You still have to because you've got a complex life you have to uphold. But it wasn't about lifting yourself out of a place where life was unstable and working very hard to make it stable. That period of growth is not now. The growth and the forming of complex structure has happened. You are fortunate enough to have been born into the time where you could have stood upon that, Contributed to it and delighted what it is to be one of those rare beings that are born in a time that is free of conflict with the ease and the opportunity to engage life and appreciate it. What happens when we keep taking out when we've already got enough is like trying to breathe in when we're already full. It makes us sick and if it never occurs to you to breathe out well it starts going wrong. It collapses. So you know we can only be our little part of this world but don't think that the solution comes in finding new areas of growth. It's grown enough. You know a cancer is excessive growth. It is a state where the coming into being energy is too strong and the passing away is too weak. Of course when the passing away is too weak and the growth is too strong then you also get collapse but there is a time of unfolding. There is a time of breathing out and it's now. So when you look to the world and how you're going to engage life and the world and how you're going to engage in it please do not look back to how two generations before you engaged in it still trying to find a comfort and stability because that bit here has been done. There are places where it hasn't been done but here it has. There is enough for everybody. So please stop asking for more because if you keep asking for more and keep taking out then you are part of that breath that is no longer possible. It's not possible. So when those who have enough don't say that's enough and start putting back there definitely isn't room for those who don't yet have enough to keep breathing. So this is how it is. You watch the natural order of things and things breathing in and then there are things breathing out. There are things coming into being and there are things passing away all the time and everywhere and that's why it stays for billions of years in a state of balance. When it doesn't stay in a state of balance is when we don't breathe out when it's time to. Our solution, Our resolution, Our balance and our progress and our growth if you like does not lie in growth. Our progress now, Our evolution, Lies in finding a blissful way of finding a way of finding a way of breathing out because if you are honest with yourself you will see that there is only a peace to be found in breathing out now which means putting back. It may be that we are not able to find peace in our own lives. Which means putting back. It may well be that you are in a place where the standing state is somewhere where you could rest and stay there and be and that's fine because there is that moment of growth and it's an exquisite moment when everything is just there, Neither growing nor passing away. The reason we have to not cling to things is because it happens briefly and in order to appreciate it totally we have to also be willing to be with the growth and the passing away that are entailed in getting to that momentary state of being. So if you can't embrace everything that it means to come into being which is being born, Growing, Decaying and dying then you won't yet be at peace with what it is to be. That letting go as you reach the zenith of your life and allow yourself to unwind is not in itself suffering. When you are in alignment with what is happening to you there is a bliss every much as powerful in that experience, The experience of giving back and letting go as there is in the experience of taking out. It's important to learn when you've had what's coming to you and delight in the fact that it came and saying thank you reflect upon what it is that you can put back. So you know the planet is going to be a place where you can be a part of it and you know the planet is going to contract, It's going to breathe out, Humanity is going to breathe out one way or another. Now breathing out can be a huge sigh of relief or it could be to expire. Our life ends with an out-breath. So you know we hold it in our hands as to whether we are going to learn to delight as much in breathing out as we delighted in breathing in. And that's where we are, That is our karma. We came here in this time. We didn't come here at another time to learn something else somewhere in the past or in the future we'll learn what that is but we came here now and this is a time to breathe out. So I strongly suggest that you embrace wholeheartedly the idea of doing so because in it is a bliss. I would even say far greater than the black bliss of breathing in. The bliss of having delighted in what it is and delighting in it and letting it go is greater than the bliss of not yet knowing and still waiting to see. So that will be the making or the undoing of us. Not whether we can continue to breathe in and find ways to do so but the way in which we choose or not to breathe out. That's not just when you see it. That's in your attitude to life. Now some of you are still young so you're still breathing in within your life but your attitude to life will need to be on aggregate an out breath and not an in breath because you're still breathing in within your life. But your attitude to life will need to be on aggregate an out breath and not an in breath because that's the time that you're in. Some of us have reached the stage where we've breathed in what we need to breathe in this life and have had what's coming to us. There is a delight in recognizing that and seeing that it is enough and allowing yourself to breathe out. There's no greater misery than reaching the end of your life still trying to breathe in or watching yourself grow old still trying to breathe in. To be alive and at peace with it is to embrace everything there is about life. So within the cycle that you're in as your individual life know what it is to breathe in. Know that there will be a moment of just being there and an equal period of out breath to make your life a life of balance by the end of it. And know that the time you're in will be more breathing out than breathing in. Now when we get behind that amazing things can happen. But until we get behind it we'll make ourselves rather uncomfortable even if we do appear to have everything we could ever dream of. So there is nothing to worry about. One way or another the universe keeps itself in a perfect state of balance. So don't worry about the bigger picture it's always okay. Just look to your place within it because you can be at one with it or in conflict with it and that's your choice. That's your choice. It's our choice. Look to life with your eyes open it will show you it shows you. It shows you what's going on what it is it speaks to you. If you listen you'll know what you have to do. You know where you need to breathe out. Your heart knows where you need to breathe out. Your heart knows what a relief it would be when you do it. So let go the idea that you've got to be more of anything and just be. Let go the idea that you have to have more of anything and find a delight in all the things you've already got and if you don't delight in them then give them away or share them. Don't be burdened by things that don't add to your life. Let yourself come into the state of balance. Let yourself come into the state of balance. That is the way of things. To breathe in is to receive not to take. To breathe out is to give. Rest effortlessly. With everything as it is. Right well that gives us something to think about doesn't it? So breathing in receiving and the clear message here is breathing out and giving back. So we're going to talk about what came up for people. Oli how did you find that? I found the talk very interesting. I think it's a very interesting talk. I think it's a very interesting talk. I think it's a very interesting talk. I think it's a very interesting talk. How did you find that? I'm personally you know I'm very new to listening to Bergs and a new student I would say and new to meditation. I would firmly call put myself in that beginner bracket. When I hear this sort of discussion for me personally it is you know it's really out there. And it's you know I'm sort of here just like trying to take it all on board and for me when he is talking about you know the in-breath and the long out-breath especially the in-breath for me he is referring to the collapse of civilization and how we what we can do as humans to try and prevent it to prevent such an occurrence. Okay I just want to bring Bergs in on that point. Bergs are you talking about the collapse of civilization? I'm not talking about the long out-breath as the collapse of civilization no. What I'm saying is if we don't start to breathe out as humanity now we are likely to face the collapse of civilization. The out-breath is a natural response it's something that has to come about at a point. Once the in-breath is complete if you don't breathe out things go wrong. Our systems economic, Political, Social at a global level have been expanding for so long we've reached a back pressure that is totally unsustainable and for as long as we look to the future in terms of how can we continue to grow we're going to take ourselves into a more and more unmanageable situation which ultimately can only end up with a collapse. The only response now is to completely embrace the absolute certainty that we have to start to decompress as a species so that the planet can decompress with us so that back pressure we created in these years of extraordinary growth and out-take on the planet can start to be reversed so that the natural cycle can be maintained. So no the out-breath is not the collapse of humanity the out-breath is a natural response which if we don't take it we're going to face at some point some kind of collapse. So there's some people in the sustainability movement that are saying we can keep on growing if we grow with renewable energy if we aren't taking out as much resources as we currently are and what would you say to those people like is that possible or do we need a different model? We need a different model I mean you can we can continue to take out a little bit or a lot but there is a point where in a finite system which we've got it's not infinite you can't take out anymore so we might reduce our consumption net consumption to the point where we can carry on for another three or four hundred years if we don't reduce it at all we're probably not going to carry on for another 50 but that isn't the point if you look at the human appearance on this planet in the climate we're going to be able to do that and we're going to be able to do that in the context of the planet in general this is billions of years that life has sustained itself effortlessly without drawing anything out from the ground that it stands upon. Humanity's been here for two thousand years it almost depleted everything that was there so slowing down our out net outtake isn't the solution we have to see it in terms of by being here as a species we contribute to the putting back to the regeneration so that of course it costs in resource to be a human being on this planet so in order to justify our presence here we've got to find ways of putting back into the pot more than we take out not just reducing how much we take out but what we put into the pot contributes to the regeneration of what we've already taken back otherwise it whether it's 50 years or 300 years or 500 years it's done and it's such a brief time we've been here and in the last 200 years nothing and we've practically consumed everything that there is in terms of sustainable resources. So are you saying both that we need to live our lives like we the human like mankind did I don't know 100 years ago 150 200 years ago? No possibly we're going to have to look at the levels of consumption that we've used to but we were taking out then at the early stages of this long in-breath and period of expansion we have to see it in terms of net contributors not in terms of being as minimal as we can as net takers so what do I mean by that for example in your time here on the planet how much can you contribute so for example let's say you Olly you know you're going to be here for 80 years if you planted 20 trees a year or 100 trees a year and left them behind that's going to be less than the trees that you took down hopefully got to work it out what have you taken out okay what does it cost to have me here what do I need to put back in the pot to make my presence here not a burden to the planet as a whole that's a big ask and that's the question we've got to be asking because sooner or later it runs out if we don't think like that now I'm not saying we can't take anything because the planet is immensely bountiful so there is a level at which we can take out and it's sustainable but we've taken out so much that if we don't put back and put back and put back it will just stay at this relatively barren level and gradually deplete the ecosystems all the natural order is creaking under the pressure that we put under it we've got to put something back in the pot it's not a question of just about whether we can reduce our carbon emissions by 20 percent or get it to net zero we've got to contribute bottom line it's a big challenge isn't it because if you think of almost as scales with all the things you've taken like all the rubbish you produce all the flights you might have taken it's like this huge exactly and now a bigger challenge you've got to look at it in terms of like what can I do with my time my resources everything I've got that isn't what I need I should be putting into the pot to turn into something that makes this planet more bountiful whether it's you've got time and hands to go and plant trees or land to offer up to regenerate or money that you don't use that you contribute but we've got to see our life in terms of what we give and not in terms of what we take out so you're talking about that on a like on a personal level you know as individuals but are you also speaking I imagine you are talking about from a commercial point of view from a business point of view businesses should be looking at not how much money we're making but how much how much can we judging success but how much we can give back into the plot is our net contribution not to humanity but to the planet because humanity is a huge taker so when a when a when a company is judged for its sort of value it's looked at terms of the value it gives to humanity but that isn't real value real value is that the value it gives to the ground that we have to stand upon to support our presence here and it's a paradigm shift it's a complete step outside the box because all our current thinking is in terms of what can we give to humanity but you know humanity if it just carries on like this is just going to take everything out on the planet won't be here like this or we won't be here but one thing's for sure if we all disappeared in a puff of smoke right now 200 years from now this planet will be a paradise again how can it become a paradise again with us here that's the question and you say in the discourse the planet is breathing out what do you know the planet will breathe out right what i'm saying is the natural order can't live in a state of conflict it always comes back to a state of balance so for example global warming the reduction in the oxygen levels life will adapt so that oxygen takers will struggle and oxygen producers will flourish carbon goes up vegetation will continue to flourish and animal aerobic life forms will struggle and it will just organize itself it will always organize itself back but the way in which it will organize itself will probably be in a set of circumstances which we are going to find it extremely difficult to survive in but it's still a natural order you understand what i'm saying you know the planet doesn't depend on us being here we're here because there are conditions for us to be here and when those conditions don't support us we aren't going to be here anymore but the planet will reorganize itself always we damage it badly it will repair itself but it will repair itself in a way that we won't be able to be here you know there was a nice age not long ago the most successful species in the history of the planet disappeared in the click of a finger having been here for millions of years dinosaurs gone you know we've been here for a few thousand years it's nothing and we could be out of here in a few hundred the planet won't bat an eyelid temperatures will rise acid levels will in the seas will increase the precipitation will change foliage will change climate will change landscapes will change life will continue with or without humanity but if we're interested in being part of that we could completely readjust the conditions on which we're here and the responsibility that comes with being the most consumptive species on the planet by far no other species on the planet depletes the planet in any way by being here period only us and we depleted so hugely that 200 years we've consumed almost everything that we could have that the rest of the planet survived on for millions of years that's a debt and we need to start thinking about how we pay it back radical changes are needed quickly that's what you're saying yeah and how and how how is that possible well that's where i'm asking you to sit quietly and work out what your life starts to look about look like when you see it in terms of i'm giving back i'm going to give back not what am i going to get what's in it for me where am i going to get what i need if you're fed and you've got shelter and you've got companionship you're a fortunate human being everything else you don't need you think you need it because you haven't learned to be happy about the fact you're fed sheltered and have companionship what am i i thought it would be very interesting actually that you talked about it in terms of the bliss of breathing out and actually when you align yourself to this way of being it actually is a complete relief i felt that was very interesting look at it breathe in it's actually quite a vexing thing the breathing in breathe out you know we've you know humanity has only got in its memory in its sort of group memory this process of breathing in trying to learn how to be here and survive in this complex form as this intelligent being that we are which doesn't survive very well in the natural order so we've struggled endlessly breathing in for two two thousand four thousand a few thousand years it's been vexing and we're now at the point where we're full we breathe in in the structure that we need to support ourselves like basic shelter until we've depleted it all clean water enough food not everywhere but here where we're consuming it most quickly we've got those things we worked struggled hard to get them and we're still going why do you think everybody is suffering so much with stress there is no relief in the system because we haven't learned to breathe out it is always a greater relief and a more enjoyable experience when you embrace it breathing out and breathing in we just haven't got a head around it why do you think that is because it's when you physically breathe out it is blissful how have we not learned to to do it in a more kind of screen screen this this perceived need for more that is so endemic so embedded in our psyche that everything that we've laid out as our human sort of shenanigans is based upon the acquisition of more and it hasn't brought happiness because we didn't get it being the most intelligent species on the planet we have the most responsibility knowing clearly being able to see so obviously that it takes so much more to keep a human being here than it takes any other species we have bigger responsibility we've got more we have to give but the sense of entitlement that we've allowed ourselves as being this intelligent species we've claimed this planet as ours to take out from it whatever we want to make our life as full as we can and the greed i want i need i'm entitled to it's my right it's become so endemic that we would never stop to say hold on might there be a responsibility of being a human being on this planet so there are obviously people who don't have enough um and who are still breathing in is are we saying that so how does that work within the context of sort of global society where we've got enough in the west but what about in developing worlds where there are still people in abject poverty well i i talk about it earlier on in the discourse you in terms of of course there are people who are still in the process of effectively coming into being and organizing as sort of communities and societies and they are breathing and it's a constant cycle over here we breathe in we've got to the point we can't breathe in anymore and there are other areas where people just beginning to breathe in and come to a state of being where it might become stable similarly we can look at it in terms of as a generation we breathe in so much that we might not even leave enough behind for the next generation so yeah we've got to look at it in terms of if it is clear that the ground that our life personally stands upon is more than it is actually acceptable or not acceptable or reasonable to expect we need to start thinking about how we can put that back into the pot for the planet so that there is a chance that those who don't have enough might have an opportunity to embrace life the way we've had an opportunity so it's about reducing what we perceive our needs to be and getting to the point of recognizing what they actually are and if you're provided for you are a fortunate human being if you're taking out more and not finding delight in being here then something's wrong and it might be because you haven't found a way to get back so you know i we see these people who've got 20 30 40 times a hundred times more than the average and there's a very poor correlation between how happy they are and how much they've got so all i'm doing is asking you to make the reflection have i got more and could i give more than i need could i give and if you haven't got your you're asking me this question in terms of what i've got to give might be material resource you've got hands you've got time you've got lifeblood flowing through you give of your life do something that puts something back you don't have to give your money away you have to give your time and energy everybody's got that somewhere i mean to to really think about and realize that this to bring this into reality a little bit um you know there are a couple of examples of people that i've met personally uh through uh burgs's retreats and uh the art of meditation retreats um one of them being a friend of ours called will who is you know he's got nothing in his pocket and and the guy is you know up in scotland planting one one thousand five hundred trees a day from my understanding we're in that region and there was another guy very interesting case when i was um at a retreat a couple of months ago of burgs's in in wales and uh there was a guy there who who had flown over from india specifically for this retreat and at the end of the retreat there was um burgs was giving a discourse and he and burgs finally asked if there was any questions and burgs can go into this in a bit more detail um but the guy owns something in the region of or his business owns uh in the region of i think eight thousand acres worth of forest in and jungle in uh in in india somewhere where they were mining where he'd been granted in his company granted planning permission to mine the ore out of uh out of the forest destroying the forest and having to move wild tigers and displace all the tigers and all the wildlife to other areas of india mass mass devastation um and um i i believe he he has you know he he went back to india and he's put a put a put a put a stop to it and and the project isn't going ahead so there are i mean extraordinary it's i i don't know over a billion euros of manganese to be up to be mined mining rights owner of the company he decided enough's enough he's gonna leave it in the ground i mean that's the sort of thing that's gonna make a difference and that was his response when he heard his discourse and he said oh my goodness i've got i've just granted we've just celebrated being given permission to mine manganese out of this rainforest in india and he went away and he thought about and i got an email saying he's decided to leave it in the ground now we need more folk like that out there and more folk like will for some way all he gets is somewhere to pitch his tent bowl of food a day and he's planting 1500 trees a day that man's a legend you know think there are untold imaginative and creative ways we can find to put something back you don't have to have a lot in your pocket to make a difference two great examples aren't they because one person has a lot and has given back the law and will has as you say that very little but found a way to use his hands yeah and those you know however many trees he's they're going to be there for the next generation he'll never see them come to fruit now that's the good back generation that is a really inspiring place to end what do you think oliv yeah i agree well what a talk uh great discussion a lot to think about and um you know some deep and powerful uh deep and powerful comments and threads coming through that discussion uh yeah um it's given me a lot to go away and think about thank you hugo yeah i just i love the the notion of getting beyond this idea of infinite growth and um moving into a state where we can just let it all go blissfully i love that beautiful so can we do it blissfully we can breathe in can we breathe out blissfully that is something that we've all got to think about wow so that really was quite something what a first episode and loads to take on i think for me like something to really practice is how we can be more blissful in that out breath you know that's something what do you have to know that hugo yeah i mean wonderful no that's the perfect invitation to start letting go some of the stress and anxiety and tension that we've got from trying to think that we need to accumulate all this stuff that we don't need and actually just to let it go and breathe out with release all that tension that we might be holding on to right so where to go from here so in the next podcast called the give back generation we're going to be talking about the podcast called the give back generation which we started to hint at in towards the end of this podcast burgers is going to explore this principle that he's introduced in the long out breath and look at it actually in practical terms about how we can apply this in the way in which we live our lives great so if you're inspired by the message the next week will be practical things about how we can put it into action and if you liked it please subscribe to our channel so our channel yes go to our website the auto meditation. Org do subscribe there's going to be lots of amazing podcasts coming out tell your friends tell your friends and uh thanks everyone for joining us and thank you everyone for listening. What happens when we keep taking out when we've already got enough is like trying to breathe in when we're already full it makes us sick. If you are honest with yourself you will see that there is only a piece to be found in breathing out now which means putting back.