Innocence

Welcome to In the Deep.

I'm your host,

Catherine Ingram.

The following is from a Zoom session broadcast from Australia on June 20th.

I really love animals.

I love all kinds of animals.

Some more than others,

Of course,

But mostly I love all animals.

The non-human ones.

I am partial to quite a few of the humans as well,

But with the non-human ones,

I find that part of what I love about being around them is that I like me around them.

Because they're just in their own nature,

And there's an innocence and an authenticity that inspires my own.

Like,

Nobody's proving anything.

No one has to be clever or particularly wise or anything at all.

I have a lot of wild birds that live on my property.

The property is their home.

And I feed them not too much because I don't want them to become dependent,

But I give them treats.

And they are so funny.

They have all kinds of antics that happen when they know that I'm up and about.

One of them,

One of the bush turkeys,

The bush turkeys are not particularly intelligent.

A lot of the other birds are,

Like the magpies,

Kind of like crows,

And many others,

But the turkeys are not particularly intelligent.

However,

There's one who's an outlier.

She's quite intelligent.

And she's figured out to kind of scratch at the door to let me know that she's waiting there for food.

I find all of these encounters in my day incredibly delightful.

And I feel that it's such a privilege to be around wild animals or your pets who are not one step away really from wild.

Their nature is still very wild.

And I recommend it because sometimes we can get very far from our authentic nature,

Because most people,

And we spoke about it a lot last night,

Most people are living in a very mediated world,

A world of somebodies.

And they're just swirling around in it,

Just cooking in it.

Somebody.

A very big kind of pressure,

Disappointment,

Jealousies,

A lot of meanness I notice.

Sometimes I occasionally look at Facebook or Twitter,

I mostly avoid those,

But occasionally there's a reason to,

Somebody tells me to look something up.

You know,

It's a platform for people to just vent and try to cause harm.

And I hear on various news platforms that famous people who are on those sites,

They particularly complain about the,

Just the vitriol that they're constantly experiencing in many cases probably because the people doing it are getting attention,

Using this other person's fame.

So,

This is the world we live in.

I recommend delinking from it as much as possible,

And putting your attention elsewhere into the sweet world that is left.

If you live in a city,

You can go sit in a park and watch the birds,

Or watch people walking by with their dogs or the babies and the little kids.

They also still have their own nature pretty well intact.

That's why we love being around them.

As I said,

I like me better.

That's what's great about it.

I like me better when I'm around those characters.

I love being with Dharma people because we are more like that.

We are more like that than the general run of the mill.

We value it.

We value authenticity we value true nature we value innocence.

I think it's important to give extra honoring to that,

Because you will perhaps feel alone in it in a lot of company.

The world is going at a very different pace,

And the values of the world.

I have to say they never have been worse in my lifetime.

In terms of a general mass hysteria and mass hallucination,

Where we're out of step.

We're out of step with the madness,

The insanity,

The cruelty,

The greed,

The personal obsession,

But we're in good company.

The great ones that we remember,

The ones we loved and treasured.

They were misfits.

A lot of them got assassinated,

Crucified,

Or shot.

They were misfits.

When you have that,

When you see that innocence,

When you want to live as that,

The people who live at the other end of that spectrum,

They see you as a threat,

Even though you're the most harmless.

They see you as a threat.

And so,

When you're with someone,

Not only is it a threat because of its own inherent power,

Because there is an attraction about it,

But it bugs people who live in a lot of darkness and madness,

Because they're confronted with the contrast,

And they want to destroy it.

And another piece of the misfit life is that sometimes we have to live apart from the others,

Just for safety,

Just for sanity,

Just for peace.

And that's okay too.

We're good at retreat.

I'm just wanting to encourage us to,

In these wild times we're in,

Be vigilant about being seduced by any parts of the craziness.

And hang out with the sweethearts,

The Dharma sweethearts,

The little kids,

The other animals.

I'm good today,

Catherine.

I'll take that.

Today's been a good day.

I felt some space today,

About myself slowing down.

Sometimes even on Saturdays now,

I have more to do than I used to have.

I was shopping and laundry and cooking,

And just there's more to do.

And sometimes I can resist that.

But today I was in a good space,

I slept well,

And I was able to just really be pretty present and enjoy the day.

But it's not always like that,

But today it was.

Yes,

I'm so glad.

You look quite different,

I have to say.

I don't know.

People say I'm looking okay,

But I mean,

It's really what's going on in the insides.

And it's a rollercoaster,

You know,

It's a rollercoaster.

I can be fine,

And then it's even the grief,

It's every bit of probably more intense now than it was at the beginning.

It's deeper.

I think on some level,

I'm still just accepting it.

Even though I know logically,

April's never coming back,

But still a part of me must.

Like a couple of weeks ago,

I haven't really thrown out any stuff or donated any stuff,

But I said I'll start with,

I wanted to get rid of all the hospital papers,

Because there's so much stuff,

So much paper.

And I just got rid of all of them.

And then I decided April wanted her books donated.

April just really read a lot of novels,

Hardcover novels that she bought secondhand.

She never bought and she never marked them.

So there was nothing personal really with them.

But still,

It was hard to still bring them to Salvation Army and give them up.

And when I came back home and I saw the empty shelves,

It devastated.

Yes,

Yes.

Just because I think it's just,

Like I said,

Maybe it's a deeper feeling that she won't be coming back.

I just have to try and accept it more and more.

And the grief,

It's so big.

It's so much bigger than it.

But I'm just trying to surrender to it.

I think I'm getting better at doing that.

Yeah,

I think you are.

A lot of it depends on whether I've slept well,

Whether I've ate well,

How I can handle it if I'm open.

And there are times where I'm kind of like,

Just,

OK,

Hit me with your best shot.

And breathe into it and try and let it go through me.

And then there's other days where I just get lost in my thoughts and think about her last few months or regrets that I didn't do something or get lost in dreams of the future.

There's nothing,

You know,

That's not going to do me any good.

So I have to work doubly hard,

I feel,

On just trying to be present.

That's what I do.

I mean,

Your process sounds so familiar,

Actually.

It's familiar to me in my own process with the loss of my brother,

Different than losing your spouse companion.

But my brother was,

He died 19 years ago.

He was only 38.

And I don't know if I told you this before,

But gosh,

I guess it was a month or two ago.

I'm losing track of time.

But I had this wild dream about my brother.

My brother was quite a character.

And always he was always in mild forms of trouble,

Not that anybody else would get hurt.

But he always was like he wrecked his car somewhere.

He lost his wallet.

He was always it was always a little mini crisis.

But anyway,

Somehow we had gone to a theater and he had the tickets and I had gone inside the theater to get us seats.

But I didn't have the tickets.

And I started realizing I'm going to have to show the tickets.

And I'm in here kind of illegally now.

And I'm in the theater and I see him walk in.

It's a big theater in my mind,

Like a New York theater,

Which you would know.

And I'm yelling his name.

And I'm very excited to be there with him in the dream,

Of course.

I'm yelling his name and he's waving to me.

He's coming toward me.

And I woke up and I was so sad.

I just wanted to go back to sleep.

I wanted to be in the theater looking for my seats with my brother,

Who I hadn't seen in 19 years,

Except in dreams.

And,

You know,

It's a process.

It's so human,

A process,

You know.

And what you're describing,

The kind of winding path of the grief,

Is exactly as I've heard it described by so many people and as I've experienced it myself.

With all the people I've lost,

You know,

Not just my brother,

But so many of my beloveds,

A lot of friends and family.

And it's a tenderizing process.

I read something that Patti Smith wrote.

And her father had told her,

And he said,

Time doesn't heal all wounds,

But time makes it easier for us to deal with the grief.

And so what you're describing is the deepening of the grief.

And sometimes I feel also,

You can't feel the deeper layers yet until the kind of initial shock.

It's just like when you're in an accident,

You know,

The body's in a kind of shock for a while.

And then it might be later that you're noticing deeper pains that you didn't at first notice because your body was using up all of its energy just to survive the initial shock.

And so,

In a way,

Your psyche was using up all of its,

You know,

Wherewithal to just get through the initial months.

And then the softer palette of colors starts to reveal itself,

That it's very deep in there.

And I mean,

I guess the only golden thread I can say about all of this is that people who have loved and lost,

Who have loved deeply and have grieved deeply,

They're the beautiful people.

You know,

They're the sweethearts,

They're the tenderhearts,

They're the ones you trust.

And when there is the possibility to have real joy again,

People who've grieved deeply have access to joy.

It's like you've got nothing to lose after,

You know,

Like you have nothing to lose now.

And so once you get through the worst of the grief,

And it's kind of metabolized,

Not that you expect it's going to be gone,

But that it's now living more gently in your system,

Then joy is possible in a really amazing way.

And you really,

I see people who've lost a lot.

I was just thinking the other day about how in the old days in Bodhgaya in India,

You know,

We Buddhists,

I was a Buddhist long ago.

We used to hang out on Bodhgaya a lot in India,

Because it was believed to be where the Buddha was enlightened.

All the great teachers came there all the time.

And in the early days,

The Dalai Lama came and just hung out for the winter in Bodhgaya.

He was always around.

So I had a few audiences with him in those days,

And I also met him in Dharamsala in California and a bunch of places.

But in those days in Bodhgaya,

When you went to the Tibetan temple in Bodhgaya to see him,

You had to wait in a kind of porch area,

Not really a porch,

But just this little ante area outside.

And often someone ahead of you would be someone who had literally just walked out of Tibet.

They look,

They had a look about,

They look like they just walked out of Tibet.

You know,

They were dressed in very dusty,

Classic Tibetan clothing and seemed sad,

Actually.

So you'd hear that person ahead of you go in and there'd be this murmuring,

He and the Dalai Lama,

No doubt he's telling the Dalai Lama what's going on in Tibet in those days.

It was very brutal,

Probably still is,

But especially in the 70s and 80s.

So you know that he's hearing things that are really troubling.

But then this person would come out,

And you could almost feel the lightness in their step.

And then we Westerners would go in,

In our innocence,

We were like children to him,

Probably,

You know,

These wealthy Westerners by their standards.

And he would just be so joyous,

No matter what he had just heard.

And he was hearing that all the time.

But he would just be,

He would just meet us where we were,

And be happy and playful and take pictures and hold our hands and,

And,

You know,

People who have really suffered.

Some people get beaten down by it,

But those who get through it,

Really have access to joy,

And really know the measure of kindness to others and how we're all struggling,

You know,

We're all privy to loss.

It's rough here.

But people who understand that are usually very cool to hang out with.

So that's what I'm expecting of you.

Well,

I do feel more open for sure.

My heart is more open.

It really is,

Genuinely.

I feel I'm trying to kind of live a little bit through April's filter.

She was more openly kind person than I was.

She was further on,

I think,

In a lot of ways.

And I'm trying to be inspired by her.

Yes,

That's another thing I've noticed is that when someone I love has gone,

I see things through their eyes a lot more.

You know,

I see,

It's like that's what they left for me in addition to the love in my heart.

I also tune into how I sometimes say,

How would Glenn,

My brother,

How would Glenn see this?

How would Leonard see it?

What would,

You know,

Poonchaji say about this?

She was more spontaneous than me and kind of said yes to life a little bit more.

I was kind of more.

.

.

Careful.

Careful,

Yeah.

So I'm trying to be,

I am trying to be more spontaneous.

I was dancing in my,

In the other room this morning to music.

I don't usually do that.

So that's a good sign.

That is a good sign.

And you're talking about April,

I'm going,

You know,

April,

I think I told you about finding the phone and she wrote a long letter to me.

And like the big,

The center point was in like blocked letters,

Do not isolate.

And you know,

And I have,

And on Sundays,

I actually find Sundays the most difficult day.

I'm learning the hard way that I have to,

You know,

I have to do stuff on Sunday.

So tomorrow I was like pondering,

There's this hike,

But it's going to be 90 degrees.

And I just said,

Yes,

I'm going to go.

So I'm doing a hike and prospect para tomorrow,

It's 90 degrees.

I said to myself,

So what if it's 90 degrees?

So what if it's terrible?

You know what I mean?

You know,

You don't regret the things that you regret,

The things you don't.

Yes.

I need,

You know,

To get out of the adventure and it should be nice.

Yes.

Lovely.

Lovely.

I had a quote I'd like to read and get your response.

Okay.

It's a beautiful quote and it's about how to get old.

And I understand it intuitively.

But I wonder your thoughts on how to actually implement it.

Okay.

Bertrand Russell.

Oh,

I know this.

I love this one.

I totally understand what he's saying,

But implementation is another thing.

It says,

Make your interests gradually wider and more impersonal until bit by bit.

The walls of the ego recede and your life becomes increasingly merged with the universal life.

So the way that I understand it in my own experience actually is that the,

You know,

You're moving through stages of development in your life.

You know,

You're going from childhood and we were talking about that innocence.

It's kind of a pre-personal phase.

You haven't even really developed an ego yet when you're a little tiny kid.

And then you go through more the strong development of an ego,

A very strong sense of self,

A very strong sense of needing to feel important.

Whether you do or not,

There's a feeling of need.

That goes on for a while.

And if you're,

I'd say,

Lucky,

You then would start to want to widen that lens out,

Get beyond the personal,

Have a much bigger space around the personal such that personal still allowed and even celebrated to some degree.

But you're not stuck there and you're not enclosed in a closet with just me,

Me,

Me,

Me,

Me.

What about me?

So what he's saying,

Though,

Is that your interests start to widen and you start to feel much more a part of a much bigger picture,

A bigger story,

Not just of your own moment in history.

Good enough.

Pretty great to feel part of this historical blink in time that you happen to be here.

But also you start to feel a limitlessness to the show that's going on and it starts to include everything.

And so when he says the interests widen,

It's another way of saying that there's an expansion of the sense of self,

That there's an actual expansion of your feeling of what you are and what you're part of.

And I sometimes used to say that we live in eternity,

But just for a short time.

Do you get that?

We're living in an eternity.

That's our home.

But we're only here for a short time,

Living in it.

But if you start to identify more with that that goes on,

You start to not identify exactly,

But to have a sense of it.

If you start to more and more sense the eternity going on,

Then the fixation and the desperation about the personal momentary manifestation is not so important to you.

It's important still,

But it's not the all in everything anymore.

And you just live in bigger space.

And everything's allowed in the bigger space.

Grief is allowed,

Of course.

It's going to be there because the personal does suffer.

The personal does suffer.

And anyone who's trying to tell you that you can skip over that part is deluded or just not honest.

I would say that really only sociopaths skip over the feelings of grief and mourning and responsibility to others and connection to others.

But for the rest of us,

The personal is,

You know,

It's fun and it's got a lot of sorrow in it.

And if you're only stuck there,

If that's your whole thing,

Your whole story,

Which is true for many people in the world,

They never get beyond that.

They never get beyond the personal stage of development.

And many of them go even to their deathbed so stuck in the idea of the personal that they don't even realize they won't admit that they're dying.

But in Bertrand Russell's view,

This sense,

This massive sense of self,

Unlimited,

In a way softens the blows of the personal.

Thank you.

You're welcome.

I was just thinking when you were speaking in the beginning about the animals and nature,

And that is 100% what quickly gets me there is that is a no judgment zone.

I think if we didn't judge ourselves constantly,

And then we of course didn't judge others,

We could quickly get to that authentic place.

I think that there's so much judgment,

And a lot of it is ourselves judging ourselves.

But if we're like the animals,

They're perfect examples of that.

So it's very helpful.

I like that example you gave.

Yeah,

This may seem a kind of weird sidestep,

But one of the crazy turkeys that I've told you about many times.

One of them,

My main guy,

Turkey Turkey,

He's been here since I moved here and he rules the scene.

And he's extremely selfish.

He won't share.

Like even if I give him a pile of bird seed,

And I try to give one of his friends who are hanging around,

If I give them like one strip of spaghetti,

He runs over to take their spaghetti and then goes back to his pile.

And he's,

He's shameless in it because he,

There is no self consciousness.

And it just always makes me laugh.

It's like,

You just don't share.

Some of the other birds actually share with each other,

Some of the other turkeys will share with each other,

The girl turkeys tend to do that.

He doesn't,

He won't do it ever.

And I've known him now for quite some time and it just always makes me laugh.

He's just himself.

And now obviously I'm not making this point by way of saying,

Just,

You know,

Just refuse to share and be yourself be greedy.

But there is also something about having a permission to not as you're saying not judge yourself about minor infractions or certain impulses that you have,

You can usually mitigate the action,

Right,

Even if you feel like being selfish,

You're,

You're enough of a socialized creature that you won't just act on it.

But to know that it's fine that it arose.

It just,

It just does.

This is a,

An important understanding along the spiritual path because a lot of spiritual paths are trying to train you out of having certain types of negative impulses,

And they even think that there should be punishment for thought.

And for,

And for the arising of impulses even when these impulses have been resisted.

And then a lot of people are basically kind of selling these programs that are meant to sort of purify your mind.

I've never found any that were impressive in this regards.

But what is impressive is that you have enough space and calm around your crazy thoughts and your crazy impulses and your selfishness that nothing comes out of your mouth about it you don't speak it,

And you don't do it.

It's really fantastic.

I always feel safer with people who actually have an understanding of their own madness.

I always feel safer with those people who are honest about those things.

Hello,

I see you.

Nice to see you too.

Yeah.

Yeah,

I appreciate,

I appreciate you talking about animals.

We lost our dog a couple years ago and it's amazing I still miss him every,

You know,

Every day I think about him.

I just you know miss this company.

But at the same time you know there's a lot of animals around and I brought in that the other types of critters you know,

You know just have really like warm feelings for them.

You were talking a moment ago I was just thinking like yeah,

How much of a free pass animals get for their behavior,

You know,

Like some of us.

You know you go oh wow that's their nature or our dog,

His mother quit giving him milk you know and he had a hard,

He had a hard time in the beginning.

So he had certain things certain places you touch him you know where you'd feel like he could,

You know,

He would buy you.

Yeah,

He was force fed.

I don't know we don't know what it is,

But.

But you,

You really,

You really accepted in them.

I think it's not so much what their faults are but kind of what they give,

What they give,

You know,

That outweighs.

Yes,

Absolutely.

Especially in the case of dogs,

They're,

They're the most loyal of friends.

I think maybe the deepest thing is,

You know,

You get you get to a certain age and certain physical things and you and you think.

Yeah,

You know I could be dead in the morning you know.

And,

You know,

It doesn't,

It doesn't like grace.

It doesn't race to much emotion you know or anything it's just the sense of seeing things more loving things more and also just accepting the nature of things that's the way it is for the people that you lose the creditors that you lose my own loss more to me is not not really about me but how other people might take it really.

Yes,

Yes.

That's on the list of things one thinks about,

Of course.

There's so many things that are coming to talk about so many so many things happening nothing really earth shaking.

I lost a buddy who I knew through Aikido.

We weren't like really personally close we didn't spend a lot of time outside of Aikido together.

I mean,

We did some because the group would get together sometimes but he was the sort of guy.

I mean he was just very,

He's just very big and he cared a lot and very sort of Shakespearean,

And I don't know.

Don't know what exactly there is to say about it that the.

He died rather suddenly he was not sick,

He went in for an operation and it didn't go well.

As these things can do,

And I guess among other things you know it does make you.

It gives you a certain opportunity to say to yourself well,

This can happen.

Don't,

Don't pretend that it can't,

And just try to be mindful.

We were the same age.

I actually found myself talking to him the other night.

And I not that I thought there was some presence there that could hear necessarily but just you know for myself.

That's always an interesting thing I find when someone is gone.

I would,

I would have to say that there are many times and perhaps too many times to bear that I wish I had said certain things.

Now I don't know if that's what you're referring to just now,

Maybe you were just shooting the breeze but just wishing that you had also given him some more energy.

But I have sometimes,

And I still live with certain types of regrets of just wishing I had said something more or something,

Or said anything like just contacted them.

I led a retreat in April here in Victoria,

It was only a three day retreat it was for private company.

And the thing that came to me so strongly during this retreat was that I really needed to call lots of my old friends around the world.

Because I've just kind of not been in touch if people don't show up on the zoom I'm not you know making phone calls and in the day,

All over the world and I've,

Because I've let these sessions so much all over everywhere.

As you know,

I have a lot of old friends scattered about.

And it would really take an act of will to go down my whole contact list and start getting in touch but I've been picking picking off at it.

Even just not not having any big conversations,

But just checking in just to,

You know,

That that that is the sharing of love just showing up for each other and being present and saying hello and,

You know,

How's all this been for you.

I think,

I think one thing that's playing through in this is again it was this was not a relative,

This was not somebody I had a project going with you know was a guy from my dojo I mean there's a certain,

Whether there's a certain honor involved actually,

But the,

You know,

I remember you know,

Being younger just sort of hiding from this kind of thing or just letting it go you know I hate that he's gone that sucks but maybe I'll donate to his family's fund what you know.

And there's a memorial that's going to be that six hours away,

Coming up for him and I just feel like you know for crying out loud.

It's the Willy Loman line,

Attention must be paid.

You know what I mean.

I don't know that line but I believe you.

Arthur Miller yeah yeah.

It's like it's like,

I just think there's a sense of don't let this drop.

You know I mean there's a there's a process to grief to right I mean there's just things that we do spend a lot of time we are able in our lives and in this connected age and what have you to let a lot of things go and to just be let the next thing come through and watch the next TV show or whatever and I.

There's a sense here of well this happened and there's some things that need to be dealt with,

And it's not,

It's not particularly easy and it's not convenient.

But,

But I just that sense of rectitude that's that seems that's coming through it.

There's also,

There's also a case to be made that you would be with your fellow dojo friends that that's something in terms of the honor of being a community,

Even though you know it's a kind of specific focus and interest that you share,

But there is something about standing shoulder to shoulder with your fellow keto practitioners.

Right.

Yeah,

Yeah,

And just just to finish it off yes exactly and I think more than anything in this day and age when when,

Especially when things are so polarized my god are things polarized in this country,

The sense of continuing community,

Whatever it is,

And the sense of,

You know,

Not sending it off to the side and,

You know,

Being that individual but really honoring in whatever way that that,

You know,

Whatever connection you have and can continue to have and to try to cultivate in whatever manner,

It just feels more important.

And he died in a way to allow that to happen I mean,

Not not that there was anything deliberate but it's like you know plants die and then other plants grow out of the mulch,

What have you.

Yeah.

Yeah,

That's good.

It's interesting how many themes that people are talking about that are resonating with me,

I had two experiences of people dying last week one one person I hadn't met just a child that was in our care,

Unexpectedly died a three month old child,

And we were finding ways to to acknowledge such a brief,

Only happened on Thursday just someone's life.

They're in one of the,

We were offering intense support for family.

So,

When I say in our care in our care in a program but not living,

Not living in any sort of direct way with us but we were offering very intense support to this family and this,

This child died and we were exploring ways of honoring a little life of three months old in a way that was authentic.

And our people who worked more closely with the family who admit the child and been with the child of course they had more of a connection.

But we've only really been with this child for six weeks in our,

In our midst so it's it's how to authentically feel that without making it into some people felt most deeply and they seem to make it more about themselves.

So I'm sort of weaving back into that theme.

And I,

And then on Friday,

There was a memorial service for someone who used to work with us.

37,

And he died unexpectedly.

I don't really know if it was suicide but quite possibly is what the coroner says.

So I watched his funeral online and some of our people,

Some of our work friends went there.

And so it was just interesting having that having that experience.

And he was a very nice guy quite well so I felt I could be more authentic in watching and being a part of that was the thing about being a voyeur to watching somebody's life being celebrated because it was a celebration there was lots of color and there was lots of recognition of that,

And recognition that he lived a very complicated life and was a complicated person and had lots of challenges.

So,

It felt quite authentic so that was happening.

And then,

Our theme is,

I really struggle with judgment,

Judgment of me of how I am in those spaces because I don't want to be.

I don't want to just kind of want to be as real as I can be,

And that could be that I'm sad that very sad that baby's gone and died.

It's very sad it's very sad that our friend is an informal work colleague is is died so young and so unexpectedly,

But I,

I'm trying not to judge myself.

I'm not so much interested in judging others it's more just about myself.

So,

I guess what I'm asking for now is just some reflection around judgment,

Alongside authenticity,

Because that's something that I hold really as a strong value and and I struggle with the whole judgment piece,

Clearly.

Yeah,

The word that is coming is simply forgiveness.

You know that you can offer yourself forgiveness.

Even just saying the words that you were always doing the best you could with what you knew at the time,

And really take a look at that to really say the words to yourself and see if they're true I'm not imposing them.

But whatever,

Whatever missteps or regrets or whatever it was.

See if you can see that at the time.

You were at the maximum of what you knew,

And how you responded that it was your best at the time.

See when I say for instance.

I regret that I didn't say certain things,

You know,

I regret that I didn't hug my brother the last time I saw him because he was sweaty,

And I didn't want to hug him.

And that was the last time I saw him.

But I didn't know at the time that was going to be the last time I was going to see him.

I do forget now which is a kind of reminder to me to be careful going forward,

But I don't really beat myself up for that regret from the past.

I just know that I learned something from it,

Because I do live with this.

I wish I could have played that again but I can't.

And maybe that benefit will be accrued some other way.

So,

If you can in your own case,

Just have a deep forgiveness to yourself,

Really deep and profound,

About many things,

Many,

Many different things perhaps,

And to really see that you were trying and that in fact,

The other part of this is to see all the times.

And I'll bet in your case,

There are many that you were heroic,

And that nobody but you actually knows that the many times you turn the other cheek the many times you did forgive people who harmed you,

The many times that you were generous,

Anonymously,

Right to strangers.

The many,

Many,

Many times you stepped up when nobody else did.

All of those things are woven in.

They're woven in somebody you know you heard last night on the call,

The beautiful line,

The interwovenness.

It's all interwoven in us that is part of this manifestation,

But as we go,

As we go along and deepen in the process of,

Let's call it spaciousness around the sense of self.

It is automatically more forgiveness,

You become.

I like to say,

And I don't know if this image will work,

But you become almost like a loving parent to yourself.

Like,

If you had your dream parent who really understood you and was on your side.

But let's say that you can be that more and more for yourself.

Sometimes I literally say to myself,

They're there dear,

They're there dear,

Calm down.

And there's this kind of sweetness that starts to be part of who you are and how you experience you and how you experience other people.

And you get more playful,

More silly,

You take more risks,

Because you,

Again,

You don't feel like you have anything to lose.

You're not dependent on somebody's opinion of you.

And you're starting to have much more free opinion of yourself,

Because only you know what you've suffered.

And only you know what you've risen above in your suffering.

And you would know that that's a very long list.

So there's a way in which this gives a certain bravery of heart.

It just makes you more solid and more brave as a person willing to play it fully with as much wisdom as you can bring to the situation.

But also knowing you're probably going to make mistakes along the way.

And you'll live with those and you'll learn from them.