Adam Gold On Self-Acceptance And Boundaries | SFTS Ep 11

Good morning,

Good evening,

Good afternoon,

Wherever you may be,

Whatever you may be doing.

Hello and welcome back to Stories from the Soul.

Today's conversation is one I've been quietly looking forward to for a very long time.

Not because it needed hype or drama,

But because it carries something steady,

Something deeply human.

My guest today is my friend,

One of my closest friends,

Adam Gold.

We've known each other for over 30 years and over those decades one thing has remained consistent.

Adam's quiet ability to meet people where they are,

Without an agenda,

Without performance,

Without needing to prove anything.

In this conversation we speak about a number of things.

It's an opportunity to eavesdrop in on two good friends just talking,

Reconnecting.

We speak about parenting,

Work,

Identity,

And what happens when you stop trying to earn your worth and start knowing it and trusting it.

Adam reflects on raising his daughters with self-acceptance rather than fear of rejection.

On learning to draw boundaries after years of over-giving and on the understated power of humility in a world that rewards noise.

We also talk about paying attention.

We talk about how all too often we are walking the same paths,

The same journeys as our closest friends.

But the modern age has told us that we need to book time in to connect,

As opposed to just picking up the phone.

We'd remember a lot,

Not just about our relationships with those who are closest to us,

But also our relationships with ourselves,

And also remind us that things may seem like they're okay on the outside to our friends and to our family,

But they might not necessarily be the case on the inside.

This isn't a conversation about optimization or self-improvement.

It's about presence,

About confidence that doesn't shout,

About that love that turns inward before it looks outward.

So settle in,

Relax,

And listen.

This is a gentle,

Honest conversation about what really matters with Adam Gold.

And go.

Adam Gold.

Hello,

Buddy.

How are you?

Well,

Hello,

Therero Mundawara.

This has been a long time coming,

Not just this evening,

But in the last couple of weeks as well,

And months prior.

So I'm very,

Very glad and honoured that you could make it on to Stories from the Soul,

Amigo.

Thank you.

I'm delighted,

Delighted to be here.

I've been enjoying listening to everything.

So keep it up.

No,

I appreciate that.

I appreciate that.

And yeah,

I've wanted to,

Literally,

There've been,

There've probably been a handful of people who I've wanted to get on.

There was a friend of mine who was on a couple of episodes ago,

Wanda.

There was my brother.

There's you,

And there's a couple of other people as well,

Who I want to get on the show.

And I think we'll just jump straight in.

And to be honest,

I mean,

We've spoken about this,

And you said,

And I kind of paraphrase.

And,

You know,

Essentially,

You were like,

Why do you want me on the show?

And honestly,

Look,

We've known each other now for,

Whoa,

Since 1994?

Yeah,

More than 30 years now.

Holy cow.

Known each other for 30 years.

And I'll be honest,

You know,

There's been one thing that has been consistent about what I've seen with you,

Just kind of observing you,

Is your ability to,

And I don't want to,

I guess,

Diffuse isn't the word,

But just your innate ability to see the good in people.

And to engage with that part of that person.

Like,

I've always been really quite,

Yeah,

Really been quite in awe of that,

Because it's something which you just don't find all too often.

And,

You know,

I obviously know all that you've done.

And it doesn't surprise me,

All of the things that you've done.

So,

You know,

I kind of,

The first question that I have is like,

So when you think back to those early young Adam Gold years,

What experiences,

Influences do you believe helped shape your,

Yeah,

Your curiosity about,

Not just people,

But I guess the human spirit and the world around us?

Yeah.

Yeah.

No,

Thank you.

It's,

I feel very appreciative of having that description.

And I can also almost jump immediately to where that came from in my upbringing,

Because I think there was sort of a very deliberate decision by all the people that brought me up to emphasise or to sort of show me the way to emphasise what's good in life and what's positive and what's optimistic.

You know,

My life started with a bit of a shock.

I lost my mother giving birth to me.

And I was brought up by my dad,

Of course,

But also by my grandparents,

His mum and dad,

And by one of his sisters,

My aunt and my uncle.

And then eventually by my step mum,

Who came on the scene six or seven years later.

And I was very lucky.

I had this whole safety net of people who stepped in to raise me.

And actually,

I actually had a bedroom at my grandparents' house,

Another one at my aunt and uncle's house.

So I had three,

Three homes in my upbringing,

All of whom worked together as a team,

But they all had kind of slightly different vibes and atmospheres.

And so,

So for me,

You know,

I think part of that,

That team of people,

Sometimes they say,

You know,

It takes a village to bring up a child.

So I had this team of people and there was this sort of aura of sadness in my early years because of what had happened to my mum.

And so there was sort of a collective decision was what I picked up to try and not make me be defined by sadness and things that were not good,

But actually to kind of accentuate the positive,

Find the positive in things.

And so they had a big impact on me,

All these people raising me.

But also when you are switching between different homes constantly,

You're kind of adapting and you're wanting to really maximise and help everyone have their best possible life and their best possible experience.

So somehow that kind of,

I guess that part maybe came to me more naturally from genetics.

But no,

I mean,

For you to,

The way you've kind of put that,

I feel very honoured to hear that.

But I also feel that I,

It makes a lot of sense.

I do,

I have tried hard over the course of my life to do my best to help everyone around me to continually have their best experience,

Live their best life and shape everything to be as positive and optimistic and friendly and happy as possible.

So,

And I mean,

I don't necessarily believe there's a magic formula,

But how do you do it?

Like,

And maybe not so much now,

But can you remember an experience,

You know,

In those early years where you were like,

No,

I need to see the positive intention that this person or that this situation is creating?

I mean,

We were kind of,

We come from a huge family.

My dad's got 21st cousins.

A lot of these people live locally.

We were around family a lot.

We were at the centre of a kind of local community.

My grandparents ran a local shop selling knitting wool and volunteered for lots of charities.

And so there were lots of,

You know,

People in the local neighbourhood coming and going into this shop all the time.

And they were involved in lots of different community organisations and charities.

So there was constantly people around.

And from a very young age,

I was kind of needed to constantly,

Let's say,

Not entertain,

But kind of just be in conversation with all kinds of different people of every age and every walk of life.

And I was the oldest child,

The oldest grandchild.

There was a sort of certain expectation that I had to kind of represent the family and stand up and make people feel welcome.

And so,

Yeah,

I think part of that,

You're going to get a real mix of characters.

And some people are very extrovert and forthcoming.

And it's very easy to sort of latch on to exuberant,

Positive things.

And other people are quieter and shyer.

And so I guess I learned from a very early age to sort of adapt my style and way of just dealing with any other human being around me.

And to see if I could coax out of them something that was positive and good.

And what kind of feel good factors I could help them to find just through having a conversation.

And yeah,

I think the way I am in my life came from that time in my childhood.

Like what age are we talking about here?

I think I'm very young.

I was one of those kids who was talking at a very,

Very young age,

Partly because I was around all these grownups who were constantly talking to me,

Chatting to me.

So I just kind of,

Okay,

This is how the world is.

You just chat,

Chat,

Chat away to loads of different grownups who all just want to have a chat with you.

So,

You know,

You have to adapt to your circumstance.

That was my circumstance.

It was the opposite of,

I guess,

You know,

Some kids,

They live a very outdoorsy life.

They're very physical.

They're jumping into rivers and they're climbing up trees.

You know,

My childhood was just being around a constant stream of grownups having chats with them.

So,

I mean,

Would you describe yourself,

How would you describe yourself as naturally?

Naturally introverted or extroverted?

I'm very extroverted.

Yeah.

As in the definition being you get your energy from being around other people.

And that's always been the case?

A hundred percent,

Yeah.

I am,

Sorry,

Go on.

No,

No,

Sometimes I find myself saying that,

You know,

I've probably not spent more than five minutes in my own company.

I mean,

Just to circle back to that,

I have always been quite astounded.

And I use that word deliberately,

At your ability to coax things out of people.

And it's very interesting because it's not,

You know,

Some people do that in a manner whereby people just get put at ease.

And like the defense has come down.

But your style of engagement isn't necessarily like that.

It's inquisitive,

But not interrogative.

You know?

And it's something which I think has been very rare.

I haven't actually ever seen that before elsewhere.

And so I just want to just kind of unpack that a bit.

Is it just you find a thread and then you go from there?

Look,

Don't get me wrong.

I know none of this is deliberate or contrived or anything.

You know,

It's not what I'm saying at all.

I guess I'm just,

Because a lot of people,

A lot of people find discomfort making small talk.

And they find that,

You know,

That's probably one up there,

You know,

All up.

That is probably up there in terms of,

You know,

Fearful situations along with public speaking and,

You know,

Waking up walking naked to school.

You know?

But yeah,

Like,

What would you say in that to people like that?

Who have that concern?

I guess that in the way of being a people person,

It's not that I have any agenda to ask people questions or dig and find things out about them.

I'm really just trying to find a connection where somebody has a topic that they just want to talk about and that they like.

And we just end up having a conversation and get into things.

Yeah.

It's almost like without the agenda that I have is I guess I'm trying to find a feel good factor in people.

I'm trying to get to a point where they're just enjoying having that conversation and they're enjoying talking about the thing they most like talking about.

Yeah.

And you kind of hit the nail on the head there for me.

Like,

I think you're just genuinely and authentically curious.

And I think in their life,

The essence of it,

Isn't it?

It's just being curious about somebody else.

And there's no book formula,

You know,

Social media clip,

Which can teach you that.

Yeah,

I guess,

You know,

Part of that goes back to genetics.

Both my parents were social workers.

All my relatives have been around growing up,

Have done lots of volunteering work in sort of care sectors,

If you like.

And I've been,

There's a sort of natural empathy of just trying to understand people and where you're coming from and what you're all about.

Rather than I really want the answer to this question or that question,

Which I really don't need at all.

I'm just trying to find,

Yeah,

What makes people tick and what they enjoy most.

And it's not,

I'm not conscious of doing that.

I can be a witness to that.

From such a young age,

It's just super,

Super deep in me,

Really.

And do you see it in your kids?

To an extent,

To an extent,

They've had not quite the same sort of upbringing.

And they have been around a lot of grownups and different generations.

And there's a lot of conversing that's gone on.

So there's been that similarity.

And they're both thoughtful and respectful.

So,

You know,

I can certainly see that.

I think it was just my circumstance was somewhat extreme.

So that played out in a more extreme way in me.

And,

I mean,

You know,

We've spoken about this.

And I,

You know,

Adam's their godfather to my daughter.

And that was a very deliberate decision on,

You know,

My and my wife's part.

Because,

Well,

Speaking purely for self,

Like,

I've always been impressed with your daughters,

Just the way they see things.

From the way I think they see things.

And the way they carry themselves.

And it's,

Again,

It's like,

It's,

I can liken it in some ways to the way you engage with people.

It's a very quiet confidence,

Which almost isn't confidence.

And,

I mean,

What is it that you guys try and instill in them?

I suppose there is a sort of,

What we have tried to instill in them is an inner resolve around being,

You know what,

I'm okay.

I'm all right.

And if you can have that level of self acceptance,

Then in a social situation,

You don't necessarily feel as much concern about being rejected.

Just from having a sociable conversation,

And then somebody's like,

Well,

Just not interested and wander off.

Then,

As you say,

When you talked about people having a fear of public speaking or people having a fear of,

You know,

Nightmares of walking to school naked,

There's a fear that what if I get socially rejected?

What if something goes wrong when I'm trying to converse with people I don't really know?

And,

You know,

That could be a very bad feeling and something bad could happen.

But if you have a certain self acceptance where you just think,

Okay,

You know,

That person wasn't really interested in chatting with me.

Okay,

Fine.

No problem.

Each to their own.

It's not something to take personally,

Or maybe there's something terribly wrong with me deep down.

It's like,

Well,

No,

They were distracted.

They,

You know,

They just had their own motive or agenda that they wanted to do at that particular moment that didn't involve having a chat with this person over here.

It's no big deal.

Just don't worry about it.

And it can be really hard.

Social anxiety can be really hard.

And,

Yeah,

I guess,

You know,

My wife and I have tried with our two daughters,

Who are both teenagers now,

To just over the years,

Have them have a feeling of inner resolve,

Inner self acceptance,

Where they can just gently,

Thoughtfully have a conversation with people in an easygoing way without worrying how it sort of ends up.

And more often than not,

That does go very well.

Yeah.

I mean,

So I hear you talk about self-acceptance.

And in what you're describing,

I hear,

Which is something which you said earlier about positive intention.

And positive intention isn't natural.

You know,

It's not natural to the majority of people.

You know,

We are,

And ever increasingly so,

Hold on.

Luckily,

There's an edit button.

We are,

And ever increasingly so,

Trained to see negativity and almost comfort in negativity.

Well,

Maybe not negativity.

Comfort in,

What's the word?

Comfort in almost drama.

Like,

Plain sailing isn't what people are normally accustomed to.

People are accustomed to drama.

And when there's no drama,

And I can speak for myself completely about that,

You know,

There was a large portion of my life which there was almost a subconscious and at times conscious requirement to have drama.

And,

I mean,

How do you instill that viewpoint in a preteen and then in a teen?

It's just over many years reacting to little tiny scenarios that happen throughout any given day.

And giving a little gentle coax around,

I guess,

What one's values are around that.

It's like,

You know,

No need to make a negative comment there.

You know,

Let's just,

That person's just doing their best.

Just stop for a minute and think,

Actually,

You know,

That could have been treated a bit differently.

On that person's part?

Just from their part.

From their part.

Yeah,

Reacted in certain ways.

Like,

Just stop and have a think for a moment about the way that you reacted there or what you said.

And then reflecting on that,

Going,

Ah,

Yeah,

Actually.

There's another way.

Everyone could have had a nicer experience if I'd have reacted slightly differently there.

And so you're always kind of bringing that back to those values.

And while you were talking there,

Terry,

I was just thinking about the world and where the world's at.

And if you have a worldview like I've got,

Where you're always trying to kind of meet people where they are and meet people in the middle,

Sort of the opposite of the polarization that's been going on for the last 10 years in politics and in life.

You know,

That doesn't really work for me.

I generally go and talk to people with these different,

Ever more closed-off viewpoints and go,

Look,

Come back to the middle again.

Let's,

You know,

What do we have in common?

What do we have that,

What's the common ground?

And where do we have kind of.

.

.

Where do we see eye to eye on?

Shared values,

Shared thoughts,

Ideas.

You know,

I find it difficult to,

You know,

Imagining the somewhat deliberate moves in some quarters to try to drive societies and cultures to further extremes on either side where people can't possibly see the good in the other lot.

That's hard.

That's difficult.

And I don't think it ends well either.

So I hope gradually there's a,

What my grandpa used to call a pendulum effect and things start to kind of come back,

Swing back in the opposite direction now.

Yeah.

No,

Absolutely.

And I mean,

So bearing that in mind and current,

You know,

Where we are currently and bringing in your upbringing,

Your early years and what you've tried to instill in your daughters,

How does that cross over for you in your professional career?

It's a great question.

And actually it's something that can be dangerous.

I learned because if you don't have enough self-awareness,

You can actually find yourself unchecked,

Giving too much time and an energy and too much of oneself to all the people that you work with,

Which is kind of maybe can end up to the detriment of your own family life and friendships and health and so forth,

Because you're getting too involved.

All your colleagues are not necessarily your inner circle,

Your community and great to be extremely respectful of them and as people and as professionals.

But actually I reached a point about four years ago where I was able to start to really see where I was a bit unbalanced in life because I was giving a bit too much in that regard that wasn't really necessary because all those people had their own immediate family and friends and inner circle.

Yes,

They needed me as a professional at times,

As a manager or leader or coach or somebody who could make a difference.

But it was just finding that balance where,

You know,

Okay,

These are boundaries,

This is enough.

So what do you mean in terms of work-life balance as in pushing too much time in the office or it was just really I got to the point where there were certain things that were laid down in my early years and my upbringing that kind of created my ways of reacting to the world and at times,

You know,

When there's pressure or stress or there's sort of some emotional upheaval,

I've come to understand that we as grown-ups,

We will often revert to those things that were laid down between the ages of about four and eight years old that were really our survival mechanism that we learned when we were conscious enough and old enough to figure out what we needed to do to cope and manage and when moments got tough,

Where do we go?

What do we do?

Protect ourselves.

Yeah,

Yeah,

And the people who are around us at the time when we're children,

We kind of model them,

We learn things from them and unchecked and without having self-awareness in grown-up life,

Again,

It's a thing that can be a little bit taken to extremes and so in my case,

To go around,

What I was doing was kind of giving too much time really trying to care for all the people I've worked with and treat them all like family which actually they didn't need.

At times,

They would take that because… They were offering it.

Yeah,

And a lot of people were graduate level so they were many years young,

15,

20 years younger than me and I was somebody that they could learn from but I was probably,

Yeah,

I was just giving too much time trying to do too much for too many people and actually,

It's a case of the best of you needs to be given to your closest people and at work,

You need to do what you need to do at work in order to make money to live and in order to produce what you produce and give what you give and whatever it is that you do for a living and treat your colleagues nicely and respectfully and helpfully and so forth but it was just really having those boundaries.

It became very,

Very important and I learned a lot.

Yeah,

I can hear that.

I mean,

I was talking to someone last week about work-life balance and she had an interesting take on that phrase.

She's just like,

Well,

What's the balance because most of our time for the majority of people is spent at work and not to say that your life is your work but to really kind of question what the balance is and I guess my question to you is,

What is that relationship now,

Work v.

Life?

It's an incredibly healthy one,

I'm very pleased to say.

I guess I went on a path where I guess in my 20s I worked to live.

I wasn't so interested in work.

I was very interested in my social life and I did what I needed to do to earn some money to do things and then one approaches 30 and is thinking about getting married and having children and taking more responsibility in life.

I began to feel that I should take my work life more seriously and I began working harder and harder and longer and longer hours and that really continued for over a decade and was beginning to sort of get quite extreme again because of certain things that were laid down to me as hard work,

As a value,

As a fallback.

If the chips are down,

Work harder,

Work your way out of trouble.

Absolutely,

You can do that at times and it's a great help at times but if you take that to an extreme,

It doesn't end terribly well.

About four years ago,

I was able to gain an understanding of that from being mentored by a couple of key people in my life and that really changed and over recent years I feel incredibly motivated with work.

I love what I do.

I have fantastic people I work with.

I really enjoy teamwork with them but generally speaking,

My working hours are my working hours and then I can go and be a husband,

Be a dad,

Be a relative to all my other relatives,

Be a friend,

Be a football coach which I do out of work and not be completely defined by work and when you've got to hit a deadline,

Then you've got to do whatever you've got to do to hit your deadlines and whatever you've got to do at evenings,

Weekends.

If you have a lot of deadlines in a row,

You have a lot of deadlines in a row but then you become very conscious of,

Okay,

What are the boundaries?

What's actually important to the organization that you work for?

Don't worry about lots of other incidental things.

Just focus on the really crucial stuff.

Get that done.

Get that delivered and do it in a way that makes your colleagues as happy as possible and then live the rest of your life or in all the other hours.

Then go home.

No,

And you know what?

It's so interesting that you say that and I no longer really believe in coincidence and I started this whole conversation about saying that.

You are one of the people who I really want to get onto this call because we've known each other for 30 years.

Full stop.

Also,

There was something else and I didn't know what that something else was until right about right now.

I had a conversation with my cousin and he went through a situation about four or five years ago.

I went through a situation about four or five years ago.

From what I'm hearing,

You went through an experience about four years ago.

My point being,

I mean,

I describe you as one of my best and closest friends and fine,

You know,

We're separated by X thousands of kilometers but nonetheless,

There's been something that has happened which,

And as he said,

Work,

Responsibility,

Family,

Husband,

Father,

All of that stuff and,

You know,

Equally so,

You know,

I also had that kind of light bulb moment of,

Hmm,

The more you dig in the coal mine doesn't actually mean the more you're going to get out of it,

You know?

And again,

It was ingrained in me that,

Hey,

You know,

If you're worried about something,

Dig harder,

Work harder and you will work your way out of this.

And I don't necessarily have the answer to this and that's for another conversation but I think the corporate world in the 21st century,

Tail end of the 20th century,

Doesn't really see what our parents and grandparents experienced.

And I guess,

You know,

You use the word value,

I guess that professional value structure has probably shifted and changed and kind of like people like you and I and probably my cousin and lots of other people who are listening out here,

I look,

I say this word deliberately,

I was very fortunate to have what happened to me,

Happened to me,

You know,

And grateful for it because quite literally I wouldn't be having this conversation with you right now if it hadn't happened.

Yeah,

Our generation,

There are a number of people who I think somehow were conditioned to end up hitting a wall one day where just sheer hard work was everything.

And it's not actually.

And I would not have figured that out on my own.

I needed one particular mentor who made a big difference to me and snapped me out of what I was,

The way I was living and the way I was trying to cope with things.

And then over the next,

Over these four years,

I've learned that it's focus because if you really concentrate the focus,

You can actually bring out the quality that actually really matters to that organization.

And just 24 hours of graft doesn't necessarily deliver real focus quality.

And I hadn't really,

I didn't know that before.

I'd just been just throwing everything I could at things and listening to you,

Tari,

You know,

It's self,

Other people,

You know,

We've had moments where,

Yeah,

Again,

That's a lesson that's brought,

That's ingrained in us by our parents and our grandparents' generation.

And they,

These people have meant incredibly well.

But actually we've kind of taken that at times a little bit too literally and haven't remembered to kind of stop and breathe and take a step back and go,

Hang on a minute,

Hang on a minute.

Let's focus here.

There's a thing I learned a few years ago separately to this,

It's the Pareto distribution principle.

So it's like the 80% of the real value comes from 20% of the effort.

The 80-20 rule.

Yeah,

Exactly.

And that's,

I think,

Something I've really kept with me.

And I think the other thing I really wanted to say,

Listening to your question,

Is the power of humility.

You were talking about appreciation,

Feeling grateful.

And one thing that really harms people is too much ego and too much bluster and too much feeling that they have to puff themselves up and give it the big I am.

It's like,

Actually,

Again,

It kind of goes back to a little bit of self-acceptance and inner resolve.

You know what,

I'm okay.

I don't have to prove anything to anyone.

I just need to treat people respectfully,

Do what I need to do.

And I'm not going to get everything right.

I'm not going to be able to do it all perfectly well on my own.

I'm just going to do all I can do is my best.

And that's all any of us can ask of ourselves.

And giving the best of ourselves within boundaries,

Within giving ourselves some self-respect of,

Okay,

This is enough.

That's reasonable.

That's respectful.

It's understandable.

And just having a real sense of appreciation,

Humility,

For what everyone else is doing around me as well.

And that's not easy.

It's not easy because when you are head down beneath the parapet,

It's really hard to look up and see what's going on around you.

And,

You know,

I was telling you about,

You know,

Something that happened quite close to home.

You know,

A very good friend of my wife and a good friend of mine.

And it kind of leans into what we're talking about in that we don't really know what's going on.

I wouldn't even say behind closed doors.

I'll say going on with the people in our lives,

You know.

Just the simple fact that,

You know,

You were going through something four years ago,

I was going through something four or five years ago,

And we've known each other for 30 years and didn't know that.

And I don't know the answer as to how that remains,

You know,

Pertinent or you communicate that.

But I do think at some point in time we all decided that we had to make an appointment to contact people,

You know.

And I've just started just picking up the phone and calling people again,

Like we used to do in the 90s and in the 80s.

Absolutely.

And because in sitting and saying,

Hey,

Let's meet on such and such a day and such and such a time,

I don't know,

Something happens in that space which almost doesn't allow for authentic self to show up in a conversation.

Like,

Hey,

Like genuinely,

I don't remember the last time I looked at my phone and I was like,

Oh,

Geez,

Look at that.

Cool.

And picked up like,

Hey,

Haven't spoken to you in like,

It's probably been years.

Yeah.

Well,

I think what you're talking about here,

Terry,

Is the power of proper conversation.

I've been listening to,

Of course,

Some of your other stories from the Soul episodes and listening to the point that you've been making there.

Our lives have become communicating with some of our closest human connections through text type of format.

And that's not really very human conversation.

A phone call is better and an in-person is even better than that because 90% of communication is nonverbal.

And whether it's on the phone or in person,

You have a proper conversation with people.

You're able to really do something for them,

Which is to help them to see the wood for the trees.

We're rushing through life.

We're getting to,

We do our work and our family things and our bits of social life and try and stay fit and healthy and housework and shopping and whatever it is we need to do.

It's not so often that you're able to see the wood for the trees.

And as you said,

Very,

Very sadly,

Some people can really get lost in the woods in that way and irretrievably.

And by picking up the phone,

By arranging to meet with a friend or even a few friends together and have a proper conversation as well as having a laugh and a break from,

You know,

More serious parts of life.

We just don't know how important that could be for somebody.

It could be the most important thing for someone.

And what a great message to put into the world.

What a great thing to say to people is how about making a little bit of time for some of your closest people and having a proper conversation with them?

Exactly,

Exactly.

And that for me,

Adam,

Is the cornerstone of all of it.

And that's something which I have been learning and remembering these last couple of few weeks and couple of months.

And I know that you have got the important things to do and I thank you so much for your time.

And I want to ask you just one last question.

What would 47-year-old Adam say to 7-year-old Adam right now?

Oh,

I love that question.

Oh,

Wow.

7-year-old Adam was very interested in dogs,

Big fan of dogs.

Would have loved your dogs,

Terry,

By the way.

Would have been a big hit.

And I wasn't yet a massive football fanatic,

Which I became a few years later.

But,

Yeah,

I guess when you look back in that regard,

You might think to yourself,

Well,

Would I say something which would either help that child avoid certain pitfalls or the other way of looking at it is to accentuate the great things in life and see if they could be even better.

And I am very lucky.

I haven't had too many pitfalls.

There have been a few.

We've all had a few.

We're not going to get to 47 completely unscathed.

Definitely had a few.

But I think going back to the beginning of our conversation again,

If we look at conversations which are around focusing on the positive,

The optimistic,

The good,

And looking at kind of accentuating that and accentuating the feel-good factor,

I probably would have said,

Look,

Don't hold back from the things you really enjoy.

Just go for it and don't worry that things might not work out because you never know what you could be capable of and what you could achieve and where you could go and how great things could be.

You don't have to be – I'm all about humility.

You don't have to be too modest.

You don't have to just hide yourself away and hold yourself back.

You can actually go,

You know what,

I like this thing and I might be quite good at this thing.

Just keep going and don't worry about what other people think or,

Oh,

This area is competitive or,

Oh,

You know,

It's too hard.

There's too many other people trying to do it.

So what?

Somebody's got to do that thing if it exists in the world.

So just give it a go.

Be optimistic.

Hold your head up high and balance that with the humility that if it doesn't work out and you face rejection,

Then okay,

You're okay.

You're still all right.

You're fine.

Something else will work out.

I think I would have said something along those lines.

And I can hear you saying that actually.

Adam,

Thank you very much.

I have taken so much from these 55 minutes you won't ever know.

Well,

You will know.

We'll have a beer over it one day.

But for sure,

My friend,

Thank you very much.

We'll see you again shortly.

And just thank you for your time and thank you for,

You know,

Being one of those people in the world because it's very rare where people,

To find someone who is genuinely,

Truly,

Deeply and openly curious about not just other people but about life and sees it from a positive perspective.

No,

Absolutely,

Terry.

And thank you.

And thank you for what you're doing with this series of thoughtful,

Insightful,

Inspiring podcasts.

It's just great.

And please keep going.

Thank you,

My friend.

We'll see you again.

See you soon.

Cheers,

Adam.

And that was Adam.

You know,

That conversation stayed with me long after we stopped recording because what Adam shared wasn't advice.

It was a way of being.

And from that,

As ever,

I took three reflections that I'd like to leave you with.

First,

Self-acceptance builds quiet confidence.

Adam spoke about raising his daughters to know that they're okay.

Not because everyone will like them but because their worth isn't dependent on being received.

It doesn't sit external to them.

It lies within them.

And when you trust that,

Rejection loses its power.

You stop performing and you start showing up as yourself.

Second,

Boundaries are love turned inward.

Much like me,

After years of giving everything to work,

Adam reached the point of reckoning.

He realized the people closest to him deserved the best of him,

Not what was left over.

Boundaries,

They're not selfish.

They're how we protect what matters the most to us.

And lastly,

Humility makes everything work better.

In a world full of ego and certainty,

Adam reminded us of the power of not needing to be right,

Not needing to impress,

Not needing to prove.

Humility creates space for connection,

For learning,

For true,

Real,

Authentic presence.

This conversation is a reminder that confidence doesn't have to be loud,

Doesn't have to be the biggest in the room.

That strength doesn't need performance.

And that being fully and completely human,

Curious,

Kind,

Grounded,

Is enough.

Adam,

Thank you for your honesty.

Thank you for your steadiness.

And truly,

Thank you for your friendship.

And to you listening,

Thank you for being here.

Thank you for choosing presence in a world that so often rewards distraction.

And importantly,

Thank you for showing up.

And I ask you as I close this,

This is something which I often,

Well,

I haven't done.

I ask you to leave a comment.

Leave a review,

Leave some feedback.

Even a single sentence about how this episode affected you.

Or what you didn't like about it.

I'd love to hear from you.

We'll see you next time.

Honor your truth.

Keep growing.

And keep becoming.

Until the next time.