496: Brain Fog & The M-Factor: Tamsen Fadal On Menopause

All right,

Ladies,

I've got a really important show for you today.

And I want to say to all of you gentlemen out there listening as well,

Pay attention.

I want you to listen to the show too,

Because this is a topic that everyone needs to understand better.

And that is the topic of menopause.

Because men,

Let me tell you something,

You've all got mothers,

Sisters,

Aunts,

Friends that are women.

You want to understand this.

Understand it for us,

Please.

So today on the show,

I'm really,

Really excited to have on Tamsyn Fidel.

She's an Emmy-winning journalist and menopause advocate.

And she's leading a global movement to normalize,

Educate,

And empower women through menopause and perimenopause.

And ladies,

I just want to say this.

If you are 35 or older,

You need to be listening to the show today because many of your symptoms that you might be having,

I'm talking issues with sleep,

Hair loss,

Anxiety,

And let me tell you,

The list goes on and on and on and on and on.

I'm just letting you know what you're feeling might be due to hormone shifts linked to perimenopause.

Nobody was talking about this when I was 35.

And I am so glad that really,

Truly in the last year or so,

It has become an international topic.

Everywhere I turn now,

People are talking about this.

So I'm excited to have Tamsyn on the show.

She's going to share her own experience and how it ignited her mission,

Beginning with years of unexplained symptoms that were repeatedly dismissed as,

Yes,

Of course,

Stress.

This culminated in a frightening collapse in a newsroom bathroom when she finally learned that she was in menopause.

And by the way,

Doctors did not even know this.

She had no idea.

Nobody knew.

She realized she had unknowingly been in perimenopause,

Undiagnosed,

For years.

You know,

This is why so many women feel blindsided by perimenopause.

It's because nobody has been talking about it until quite recently.

In fact,

It was swept under the carpet.

And I know in my own life,

I always heard for years and years and years,

We should not be taking estrogen.

It leads to breast cancer.

That is all false.

That is all false.

We talk about that today,

Too.

So we're going to get into it.

So get ready for a very enlightening show,

An empowering show,

And an educational show all around perimenopause and menopause.

Here we go with the incredible Tamsyn Fadell.

So welcome to the Michelle Shelf Hunt show,

Tamsyn Fadell.

Hi there.

Good to see you again.

I know.

We just discovered that you interviewed me probably three years ago up in New York.

Well,

I wasn't in New York,

But it was on the TV show.

So nice to see you again.

It was fun.

Fun to see you.

Thank you.

This is great.

I'm so excited to be here.

I am so excited to have you and what you're doing in the world.

So thank you.

You are starting a menopause movement.

Can I say that?

Because that's how I feel.

I'll receive it.

I hope we all are.

I hope that this conversation just picks up steam and I hope that women start seeing themselves and then keep spreading the message.

That's what I am so hopeful for.

And women have been incredible during this.

I just have to tell you,

I have this whole new found respect for what they're able to do.

And yeah,

I get excited every day I wake up and talk about menopause.

What's happening?

Tell me more about what's happening for the,

Like what's happening around this movement that you're creating?

Well,

I see women,

You know,

I think women have taken the ball and are creating it.

We gave it to women.

They started bringing it into their own communities,

Watching it together,

Having conversation,

Which was the whole point is to evoke that conversation.

So it was comfortable and normalized.

And then we started seeing it happen around the world.

It's been seen in 42 countries,

Over 400 cities.

So that in and of itself is exciting.

I think the most exciting though,

Is the fact that we're also teaching younger women about this stage in life so that they're not afraid and they don't come up against something with fear or confusion or frustration,

But they come into it and go,

Okay,

That's what this is.

It's perimenopause,

Spenopause.

I know what to do and I'll move right through it and have this like incredible,

You know,

Next chapters of life.

I was in Miami with my husband,

We were crossing the street and this girl rolled down the window and she was like,

Tamsen,

I didn't perimenopause and threw her arm out the window of the car at the light.

And I was like,

And so I go,

This is great.

And my husband goes,

What'd she say?

And I go,

She's in perimenopause.

He's like,

Is it like a club?

And I go,

I guess so.

And I said,

It works out real well.

I hope it does.

But I thought that that was promising for a number of reasons because she was a young woman that like owned it.

She owned it.

And that's where we have to be with all of this.

And now she knows how to menopause and how to perimenopause.

And I really love that.

And so I'm hoping that that's where we get.

It was funny,

I was on vacation in Punta Cana and I was talking to this girl,

She works for an OBGYN.

And I said,

How old are you?

And are you talking hormones?

Are you talking about menopause?

And she started laughing.

She goes,

Yes,

Yes,

Yes.

She says,

I'm 35.

I said,

You need to be thanking women my age because you know what?

We're blazing the trail for you.

Yes.

Looking into hormones.

You are.

It's so true.

It's so true.

I love it.

I mean,

It wasn't until what,

I mean,

The last two years,

Would you say?

How long has it been?

I know for me,

I'm 57.

So I didn't,

I didn't even start going through menopausal a year ago.

So yeah.

Yeah.

Very late.

But I remember when I started,

I went to my OB and she said,

Oh yeah,

We can just put you on the pill or something like that.

And I'm like,

What?

I did my own research,

You know,

I was like,

No,

No,

No,

No,

No,

I don't want to be on the pill.

I want hormone replacement therapy.

Yeah.

I was like,

No,

No,

We don't do that.

And I go,

We do,

I do,

We don't,

But I do,

Yes,

Yes,

I do.

So anyway,

So that was like,

What,

Maybe two years ago.

And now finally,

Thank God she's,

She's looking into it.

But has this been,

How long,

Like what,

How long has this been on your radar?

You know,

It's interesting.

So I,

It came on my radar because of what happened to me.

I was in,

In a news studio.

I landed on the floor of the women's bathroom and didn't know what was going on.

Menopause was not anything in my mind.

And I saw a number of doctors after that and got the diagnosis of in menopause,

Any questions in my patient portal?

And I was like,

What?

Menopause?

How can I be in menopause?

I'm 48 or 49 then.

And of course the average age is 51.

So of course I could be in menopause.

What I didn't know is that I had been in perimenopause all these years leading up to it and had no idea.

Heavy bleeding that took me off of the set at work to a point of where I was exhausted every day.

I'd go,

I'd wake up in the morning tired.

I'd wake up in the morning after having not slept or I kind of slept,

But didn't really sleep.

Weight gain.

The brain fog was my big debilitating symptom,

Honestly,

That really took a really,

A stab at my confidence.

And so I just,

I never had any idea.

And I started asking questions like that doctor said,

Any questions?

And I did start asking questions.

And so that started in like 2020 for me.

And even during that time and the year after,

Even up until 21 and two,

I was still getting things like,

Do you really want to keep talking about that?

Like,

Do you want,

Do you want to keep talking about that?

Yeah.

Even from women.

And I was like,

I do.

Cause I think it's crazy that we've never talked about that.

I'm a journalist and this is a story I never covered.

So it's been a while.

And now it is very clear that the conversation's not going anywhere.

And I was talking to a friend of mine and she's in her early forties,

We're about 10 year difference.

And she said to me,

I went to my doctor,

I said,

I think it may be a perimenopause.

And I said,

Why?

And she said,

You know,

I'm having like hot flashes all the time.

I can feel like my whole body steaming up,

But I'm really having a lot of brain fog.

And I went to my OBGYN,

Who I've had a long time,

And my OBGYN said to me,

Perimenopause is just a trend right now.

And I said,

What?

What?

A trend?

I said,

Please tell me you walked out of that office and are not going back.

And she's like,

I just like,

I couldn't believe it.

And I couldn't wait to tell you.

And I said,

I'm like appalled by that.

But I said,

It's,

It's finally having the conversation.

It's beginning of a conversation it deserves,

But it is not a pair of jeans that we're going to try on and,

You know,

And get rid of in a year,

In a season.

So yeah,

I'm,

I'm very encouraged by the fact that,

That girls of all ages are talking about it now.

So what was it that,

That made you,

I mean,

So you've got the M factor.

Tell us about that.

Tell us about what inside of you said,

I got to do more,

Like there's something more I have to do with all of this.

I keep trying to think about like this one day that I had this like,

Oh my gosh,

Moment.

I don't,

The only time I remember that I really felt very drawn into it.

And I remember where I was sitting at the time and I just remember reading the statistic and it was years ago is that 1 billion women would be in menopause or perimenopause by the year 2025.

And I think that blew me away.

And that's globally.

I think that number blew me away.

And then I,

I think the,

The frustration of not having my own answers,

I went to social media and started doing videos and talking about it and then like realizing more women were talking with me about it.

And then we were,

I was like reaching out to people in different states and countries and cities.

And,

And so this kind of,

You know,

Network of women all over the place formed pretty quickly trying to share this information.

Now that I had one defining moment,

I do know that,

You know,

I dedicated it to my mom because I lost her when she was 51 and I never had her to talk about this.

But I also know that women that did have their moms didn't have them to talk about this oftentimes because you know,

We really,

This kind of like skipped some generations of conversation.

And then I recently had the world's hottest menopause party in Vegas globally for all women to join.

And it was really just to celebrate this time because I was kicking off this women's history month and I wanted,

And I knew the book was coming out at the,

You know,

At the end of this month and I wanted women to celebrate it and not fear it.

And so that was real exciting for me and working with a team of women and we all co-produced together and tried to pull together some of the leading voices in this space and,

And share as much information as we could.

And you know,

There's still so much more to share.

And so we're still editing like new clips and information that comes from the,

From the interviews that we've done,

Because it's just pretty fascinating what we don't know about this time in life.

It is fascinating to me.

I was,

I remembered,

I did some research a while ago on just the fact that we don't even live or in,

Excuse me,

Until the early 1900s,

Mid 1900s,

We didn't even live beyond 70 or 60.

Like the average age of death was what,

50 or 60 years old or something.

And I sat there and I said,

That's why we have no clue about menopause.

It's why we don't have a clue because we weren't even living that long.

But here's a question I have for you.

Do you feel that menopause is worse now than it was 10 years ago,

20 years ago,

30 years ago?

And all your research or people that you've spoken with,

Because I think about the food,

It's not the same food that we ate from 20 years ago.

Our bodies are different.

Like did you come across that at all in all the people that you interviewed and talked to?

Yeah.

Yeah.

It's so interesting that you say that because I don't think that we paid attention really to like all of the lifestyle changes,

Right?

And even now,

I don't necessarily think that's part of most conversation.

I think it's finally getting there,

But we didn't pay attention to any of that stuff.

And so I don't know if it's different as a result of,

You know,

What we eat and how we eat.

I have to imagine that some of the things that we do don't help,

But then I also have to imagine that we know so much more about food and nutrition and strength training and balance and stress control that I feel like it has to be a little bit better there.

I just think that women,

Why at least suffered through it.

If oftentimes they got old enough to get to that time,

Right?

So I do consider us very lucky to be able to be in this place from a lot of the research that we did,

You know,

The word hysteria kept coming up,

Which just enraged me every time I saw it,

Of like people thinking that women during this time in life were like hysterical,

Which,

You know,

It leans to the,

The emotions or the emotional side.

But I think about the fact that women had no one to talk to,

No resources,

No help.

I mean,

Come on.

So I'm,

I'm grateful for the time that we're in to one,

Be able to share the information in a very different way and not have to rely on a one-to-one-to-one ratio.

Yeah.

What are,

Do you find that there are some common symptoms of menopause?

The most common,

Definitely the brain fog.

I mean,

I can't tell you how many women I know that have come to me and said,

I think I,

There's something wrong.

They have dementia.

Something's wrong.

I know,

I know.

No,

No,

No,

No,

No,

No,

No.

What do you,

What did you find in doing all this research?

What were the most common symptoms that women have?

And I know there's a list of about 50 things that could be due to perimenopause or menopause.

Hormone shifts create a cascade of events in the body,

But no.

As we know.

Yes.

But what are the most common ones that,

That you've,

That you have found with that having to do with perimenopause,

Menopause symptoms?

Perimenopause symptoms,

Heavy bleeding in irregular periods was the top one.

It was,

It's top big indicator that,

You know,

A lot of women are told is stress,

Stress,

You're stressed out.

Yeah.

And so that,

And that's what I was told.

I had endometrium polyps at the same time.

And so they were like,

It's stress.

You know that.

Right.

And I go,

I don't know that.

Like what?

Yeah.

But it made sense to me because I was stressed.

I had a high stress job.

I'd gone through a divorce.

I was like,

Okay.

Yep.

And that was it.

I shrugged.

And that was the end of it.

That was a big one.

Sleepless nights,

A big one.

And you know,

Hot flashes are one thing,

But brain fog is really debilitating and not that hot flashes are not debilitating because I talked to a woman last night at this event and she said,

I got my first,

First hot flash in front of four men giving a presentation at work.

And I just,

It was like dripping down my face,

Dripping down my makeup,

Dripping all over me.

And I thought to myself,

Like,

I don't even know what to say.

So I,

I know that a lot of things,

You know,

Everybody comes by differently.

It's very individual.

Everyone's going to have symptoms that might be different,

Different lengths,

When it starts,

How long,

How intense.

But for me,

I think that that,

That brain fog is one of the big debilitating ones.

But in perimenopause,

The heavy bleeding is like just one of those big indications.

Yeah.

And the sleep.

Gosh.

I mean,

Everyone I talk to these days has issues with sleep.

I know.

They wake up,

They have insomnia,

All the things.

Yeah.

Yeah.

No question.

I did a whole,

I was going to kind of put brain and sleep together and instead I made sleep its own because it's just,

That's just how important it is,

Is to have those sleep habits to get.

And I wanted to give kind of brain fog proof because while I was writing it,

I was still like,

Oh gosh,

I can't focus.

And,

And it was really important for me to simplify.

And so that's what I did.

So,

You know,

There's tips and,

And advice from different doctors.

I have 42 different experts.

I have two sleep experts.

I really wanted to make sure it was all encompassing and try to get as many of the leading voices as possible inside of the book.

So people would have as many resources as they could and options.

So they could say,

Look,

If sleep's not a problem for me,

But low libido is killing my relationship in my mind,

Then they have a sex chapter.

So it was important for me to give women that kind of roadmap because how we menopause,

You know,

Is always different.

Like how I menopause and how you menopause is totally different.

Yeah,

It is.

It is.

Everyone has their own story.

I love when you said in the beginning,

I think before we even started recording that this book and the M factor for you are all about giving women choice and power,

Taking their power back.

Yeah.

And you talk a little bit about that,

You know,

Because again,

When we go to the doctor or our PA,

Whoever we're going to,

And they say X to us,

We just go,

Oh,

Okay.

Maybe I'm just depressed.

Maybe I have insomnia.

Maybe I have this.

Talk about the importance of really taking your power back and being your best advocate.

Oh my gosh.

It's the most important thing,

You know.

I think that taking charge of your health is the most important thing that you can do during this time in your life.

Really any time in your life,

But particularly this time in your life.

Because if you don't,

No one else is going to do it.

And I'm not a doctor,

I'm a journalist,

But what I want to do is always elevate the voices that I know have done the research,

Have paid attention,

Are out there talking and give them that platform.

And that's what I know how to do is to help share their resources.

And the reason I want to do that is so women feel like they have a resource and have confidence during this time.

I didn't go into menopause having confidence worth anything because I had no information.

If we have information,

We have a little bit of confidence,

We have a little stability.

We have a little bit of like,

Okay,

I kind of know what I'm talking about.

I might not know everything,

But I kind of know what I'm talking about.

So at least I can ask the right questions.

And so that was important to me.

It's important for me,

For every woman to know how to menopause,

Every woman to be their own advocate and every woman to teach somebody in the next generation coming up how to do that.

So they feel confident and comfortable.

Yeah.

Yeah.

That's,

That's beautiful.

And I,

We just have to be our own advocate and if it doesn't feel right,

What we're hearing from our doctors,

Then we have to go to another doctor.

Keep searching.

Don't stop.

Yes.

Yes.

Don't stop.

Keep going.

So,

So true.

And to remember that there's telemedicine out there,

There's telehealth,

There's a lot of different things are going to be very helpful.

So if you're in an area where you do not have a doctor that you feel comfortable with,

That you're not able to find better menopause practitioners,

There's a lot of different places that women can go to and have somebody that they can talk to.

And I think that that's what's so important.

If we have somebody that is listening and understanding and we don't feel like it's on us and there's something wrong with just us,

You,

You really can get started on the road to,

To feeling better and thriving.

And I really don't want people to think I'm throwing all this,

You know,

Shame all over the doctors.

They weren't trained appropriately.

Really?

It's not their fault.

They were not trained.

And again,

I,

When I was talking to my OB about this,

She's like,

I said,

Didn't you have courses in hormones?

She's like,

No,

We didn't.

Like they just didn't know anything about menopause.

So talk a little bit about what you learned about estrogen,

Because that's something that we fear.

I hear that a lot.

Oh,

I can't take estrogen.

That'll cause cancer.

That'll cause stroke.

That'll cause heart attacks.

I can't do that.

What did you learn?

I mean,

We did a lot of that in the documentary,

Which a lot of that in the book as well.

I really wanted to devote time to two different sides of it.

I wanted to devote time to the hormones and to non-hormonal options.

My mother died at 51.

She had a double mastectomy and estrogen,

A positive breast cancer.

Most likely had she been alive today,

She would not be able to,

Or would not have been offered hormone therapy.

So I think about her in this conversation,

Like,

Well,

What would her options be like a big shrug and good luck to you?

And so luckily we have doctors like Dr.

Avram Blooming.

We have Dr.

Suzanne Gilbert-Lenz,

A doctor like Corrine Min who really focus on breast cancer patients.

And so that's good news there.

So I wanted to provide the non-hormonal options and then going back to the hormones,

There was a lot of confusion from a 2002 study,

The WHI study of women looking at hormones and it got very confusing for women.

And at the end of the day,

This large study got women confused and equated estrogen equals breast cancer.

Estrogen will cause breast cancer.

And I've talked to a lot of doctors that were in the office that day and said they got these angry phone calls,

Like edicts came down,

Like stop with the hormones.

Women were calling,

Flushing their hormones down the toilet.

And since then,

We have looked at that,

Looked back at those headlines and what damage those headlines did,

The confusion about how that study was released and said,

Okay,

That is not what the data really shows.

And so I think there's been a course correction of sorts going on.

But me for one,

When I heard breast cancer,

Like that's,

I'm out,

You know?

And I think that that's what a lot of women still feel and a lot of physicians still feel.

Stop being studied in medical schools.

And so we have a lot of work to do,

But we don't have 20 years to do a new study.

So we have to get women this help today.

And I think that that's where we have to go back and find the most educated providers we can,

The ones that are willing to talk about it,

Understanding it,

Teaching themselves and elevate their platforms.

And I think it's really important to talk about all the changes,

Whether it's how we dress,

How we feel,

Our confidence,

Community,

Sex,

Workplace.

And so I wanted to make sure we were,

It was all encompassing skin and hair.

It's the whole woman.

It's all,

We can't divide ourselves up into silos.

So true.

Skin and hair.

Oh my God.

Everyone I know,

I know.

What's wrong.

I remember it just in my forties,

Just my friends and family that are women would say,

Yeah,

Why are my pants not fitting?

Like I've done nothing.

Everyone says the same thing.

I've done nothing different.

I'm still working out the same way.

I'm eating the same way.

I haven't even gained weight or I've gained some weight.

But it's only in my belly.

What's happening?

Yeah.

Yeah.

It's just sitting there with this little like line.

And I think that when women have those kinds of answers and they understand and they're aware that they're not the only ones going through that,

That is when you really have a woman that feels whole.

And that's what's the most important.

What happens with the hair loss?

What is going on with the hair loss?

Estrogen causes everything or lack of estrogen causes everything.

I've heard a lot of women talk about hair loss.

A lot of women talking about breakage and brittle hair.

That was another thing.

Like I have,

I have a lot of hair.

I've always had a lot of hair.

And I went through this time where hair was literally falling out like all over my hardwood floor.

I had black hair everywhere.

And again,

They were like,

It's stress.

And I was like,

Okay.

And I realized I was exactly sitting in perimenopause and nobody talked about any of it.

So I know hair is a big one.

Skin is a big one too.

And we see those changes,

But that doesn't mean that you did something wrong or you didn't do enough or you're not taking care of yourself.

Women have to understand that's what's going on in our bodies and there are solutions to all of these things.

So did you find your hair grew back when you went on estrogen?

My hair has been really great lately.

I don't know what is going on.

I mean,

I take supplements too with it,

But I was like,

I don't know what's happening.

I did cut it because I did have a lot of breakage down here at the bottom.

So it used to be,

Maybe when you met me,

It was long.

So that has changed quite a bit.

It's not as healthy as it used to be.

It's like very dry very quickly.

But yeah,

I think I've seen a lot of changes in my body as a whole with going on hormone therapy.

So I'm on a chart,

Estrogen,

Progesterone and testosterone too.

So I just started that testosterone.

What a game changer that is.

Who knew?

Game changer,

Right?

I don't think men do.

Men do this.

Yeah.

Who knew?

Tell us about the testosterone because I don't hear a lot of people talking about that as much as the estrogen and the progesterone.

It was actually my final thing that I added in.

Is that what you did?

Same.

Yeah,

Me too.

I was on HRT for a while and then I was like,

I don't know.

I don't know.

I don't know.

But I had no libido.

Like none.

I had no interest in sex at all and I was feeling very different when I would work out.

Nothing was changing.

Nothing was happening.

So I went on estrogen.

It's basically a 10th of a dose of what a man would have.

Dr.

Kelly Casperson takes a bit and squeezes it on her hand.

She's like,

Okay,

It's a 10th of a dose.

Like you're supposed to,

You know,

We don't have an FDA approved for women,

Unfortunately.

So oftentimes it's a compounded for women.

And so that's been a game changer.

It's another one of the hormones that women have had,

You know,

It's not like we didn't have it,

But there's a lot of confusion wrapped around that.

So I really try to simplify the different hormones.

Everything in the book is vetted.

It was,

You know,

It was medically,

You know,

Gone through by a doctor and I wanted to make sure that there's resources for everything.

So if someone wants to go back and look at what the actual study was or the actual resource,

I wanted to provide that too because I think those things are really important.

Some of them are very dense studies.

So I had,

You know,

I had a lot of researchers helping me put this together to make sure that we provided women everything as up to date as we could on the information out there.

And look,

I can't wait to have a revised version because that means that we had some research done.

That's what I'm hopeful for.

Gosh,

I worked out with a trainer for about six or eight months and I remember I got on that machine that measures your weight and muscle and fat and everything.

And after six or eight months,

I got back on that same machine.

What is it called?

The thing that you hold the handles and it reads you and oh my gosh,

I know exactly what you're talking about.

It's like a,

I don't know.

It's either like a really good day or a really bad day for me,

But you hold it and you,

It looks like you're going to ride a motorcycle and you stand on it.

Yeah.

I don't know what it is.

The whole thing.

Anyway.

So I got on it.

I think it was six or eight months later after I'd been working out with a trainer a few times a week and nothing had changed.

I was like.

I know.

What in the hell is that?

I was so mad.

I was so mad.

This is two years ago.

Yeah.

I was like,

Well,

She's horrible.

Like this isn't on me.

I showed her.

You're horrible.

This is her fault.

Yeah.

And what I realized was now,

And then I went and I had my,

My blood checked and my testosterone was like a seven.

Like it was way,

Way,

Way,

Way,

Way,

Way too low.

And I'm like,

Oh my gosh,

That was already happening.

And I didn't even know.

Again,

I had no idea.

Nobody ever suggested,

Hey,

Have you had your testosterone checked?

I just had it checked like a year ago.

And they said,

My,

The new doctor said,

Oh my God,

This is so low.

You need testosterone immediately.

I was like,

Oh,

That's why my gym experience was so low.

So bad.

It wasn't a drainer.

Sorry about that.

Sorry.

Who knows?

Nobody knows.

Trust me about this.

A couple of years ago.

I said to my husband,

If this is going to be the way it is,

I'm just going to eat pizza.

Like who cares?

Like what difference does it make?

Cause I was so annoyed that I was trying to be,

You know,

So like good.

And yeah,

Trust me.

I know.

Cause it just doesn't matter.

Oh my God.

I've had a couple of little mini breakdowns over that.

I have too.

I have too.

A way to rearrange your closet.

So you'd like on the day you feel like crap,

You know,

I wanted to be real with people.

I didn't want to be like,

Here's everything I know.

And I've got it all figured out.

Like I wished,

But here's,

I'm like,

Here's what I'm doing.

And like,

Let me know if you got tips.

So I'm hoping that women share like how they menopause with me,

Because I think it would be really cool to have that,

Like do something on social with it.

I would love to see that.

Yeah.

Oh my gosh.

Yes.

So what do you think about all the estrogen creams for like your skin and your face and all these things that they were doing now with estrogen other than again,

The patch and everything else we're using?

Oh yeah.

You know,

I don't,

I mean,

I know there's some research behind some of that,

So I don't know that I'm qualified to,

To pass a judgment on it.

I think if somebody feels good about that and they don't feel like it's harming them.

And I think that that is totally fine.

I know there's a lot of doctors that have done a lot of studies.

And so I'm,

I,

Again,

Though,

I go back to like,

What is going to make a woman feel best and be,

You know,

And be safe and feel good about herself.

And I think of the inside out first.

And then,

You know,

I know obviously that as you know,

Estrogen cream,

I've done it before myself and I don't know,

I don't know enough about it where I could say like,

That's the best thing in the world or never do that.

But I do think that if you are going to do something like that,

You talk,

You know,

You talk to somebody that is educated on it.

So they,

So they really understand it and know,

Yeah,

But I have a lot of women in that swear by it and really say it has been a game changer for them.

For the skin,

Even our skin changes,

You know,

For the skin,

Oh gosh,

Our skin changes in a huge way.

I've also found,

Which has been interesting to me,

Not so fun,

But I found like a lot of different allergy that I've developed to different things that I wouldn't have been able to use before,

Like perfumed things or fragrances,

Some like topical skin issues as a result of this that I didn't have for years.

So I said to my dermatologist,

Can I just assume it's menopause?

And so she's like,

Oh,

Slightly.

And I go,

All right,

I'm going to blame that.

So our body goes for a lot of changes,

Estrogen impacts every part of it.

You know,

The thing I am grateful for and that I hope that women take away is that there are a lot of solutions to this.

I hope that they understand that there's not a one size fits all and that they've not done anything wrong because,

You know,

Their friend might've breezed right through it,

But they're having a really difficult time.

And then,

You know,

I think the next charge that we have to lead is really educating men and our partners during this time.

I think a lot of men feel very,

Well,

They're unaware because we were very unaware for a long time,

But I also think that it can cause a lot of problems within relationships.

And I think that's,

It's very sad.

So I'm hopeful that more men are getting more education and that they are more supportive and that better women feel safe to open up to them and feel like they have a safe space to do that because it's a lot all at the same time.

That was on my list of questions.

I had written that down a couple of minutes ago.

You talked about the importance of talking to your partner and I agree,

We have to communicate with them,

But did you,

What are,

What would be some ways that they could do that?

Because gosh,

If we're going through it,

We don't know what the heck's going on.

What are we supposed to say to our partner?

Yeah.

It's so important.

You know,

I think it's a really honest,

Raw conversation.

I don't think it's a one,

Two,

Three.

I think every relationship's different.

I would say have that conversation out of the bedroom.

So it's not like,

Hey,

I just want to know right now,

I'm in menopause.

So that's why I'm not going to want to have sex with you.

Even though we would love to see that.

But I,

You know,

I had the conversation with Ira over a glass of wine and a very relaxed kind of dinner.

Because I,

I do know that it's a conversation that has to be had and it's confusing and it does.

And you never want the guy to think,

Or the partner to think that,

You know,

That this is,

You know,

This is the way.

It's always going to be,

First of all,

And that,

You know,

You're making me miserable right now.

So I did a letter to my partner in the book,

Just so women might have an easier time having that conversation and saying,

Look,

My hormones are changing.

My body's changing.

It affects a lot of things,

You know,

Not just my body,

But it's changing the way,

You know,

How I feel when it comes to sex and having sex and feeling good.

But I want to say this.

If there's a 35 year old out there listening,

Saying like,

Oh great.

So I'm going to have a crappy sex life when I'm 50.

No,

The answer is no.

The answer is it could be the best sex life you've ever had.

But I think that you've got to know your body first of all,

And know what solutions you're going to go after in order to make yourself feel good again.

Yeah,

Absolutely.

Tell us about the M factor for those that haven't seen it.

Why would someone want to watch that?

What would they get out of watching the M factor?

You know,

I,

When we came together for the M factor,

We had two real big goals,

The M factors.

One is to teach anything or show anything that we had gone through ourselves as women.

It's for women producers and two,

To talk about some of the areas that have not been discussed as readily in menopause,

You know,

When it comes to workplace,

When it comes to race,

When it comes to the women's health initiative,

You know,

Really explaining where that fear came from for women.

And then also sharing women's stories.

You know,

We wanted to make sure we had a younger woman talking about what happens when a,

You know,

A woman in her thirties talking about what happens when she went through an early menopause,

Unbeknownst to her,

To a woman who hadn't had sex with her husband for years,

But loved him and was so hurt by that.

So it was important.

And we talk about testosterone.

It was really important for us to try to find leading voices from the leading universities as well as leading organizations like the menopause society and swan study to be able to share everything that we know to date.

And look,

There are differing opinions in,

You know,

You can ask 10 doctors and have 11 different opinions,

But we tried to gather the top leading voices and have as much research backed information from all of these experts as we could in one place for women.

It's an hour.

So you can't get everything in an hour.

We have other videos that we have released as a result so we can have more expansive conversation.

But I think what's happened more than anything was shredding the silence on it and having communities come together and talk and feel safe with somebody else sitting there listening.

And that's been exciting to me more than the,

I mean,

I love doing the film and that's journalism is at my core,

But seeing women come together in a group,

You know,

Across the world,

Halfway around the world and this conversation blows my mind and it just shows me the power of women.

Yeah.

I love that.

You've talked a lot about community.

So how can we keep going with this message,

With this talk about menopause,

Social media?

Like what do you,

What do you recommend?

Like we need to keep talking about it.

That's why I wanted to have you on because I said we need to talk about this.

This is important.

What you're putting out in the world is important.

We women need what you're putting out in the world.

So thank you so much for saying that.

Thank you for sharing your platform with me and so many women.

These kinds of conversations,

No fear of questions,

Celebrating this time,

Not being afraid of it.

We just had the world's hottest menopause party in Vegas.

It was totally fun.

We celebrated,

You know,

This,

This time in a woman's life.

I think that asking doctors questions and making sure we don't take like,

It's a normal thing everybody does and goes through in life,

Willing to have conversations with younger women,

Talking about it in the workplace.

And if you feel comfortable doing that,

Advocating for all the women at your,

At your,

At your workplace,

If some might not be comfortable doing that,

It might,

It might be on,

You know,

The few that want to go out there and do that.

And I think that that's important.

So I think if there's any way to elevate that conversation,

And then I think women that have deep pockets,

You know,

If they can help in terms of getting research funded,

That would be amazing because that's where we've got to get next.

We've got to have,

We've got to get to a place where all women have access to care.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I couldn't agree more with you.

What,

What did you find about women that were over or beyond menopause?

You know,

There's that 10 year gap.

Like if you've,

If you've gone through menopause,

Stop your period and there's 10 years beyond 10.

Is there anything I keep asking this question?

Yeah,

Absolutely.

Is there anything in terms of what,

What to look forward to hormone replacement?

You know,

I know a few women,

Women have emailed me when I've had hormone experts on there.

What about me?

You know,

I'm 65.

I'm whatever.

The women that kind of got left out in the middle,

Right?

As a result of the study.

That really is awful.

The pregnant was pulled off the shelves,

You know,

20 years ago and now they're like,

What about me?

What am I supposed to do?

Yeah.

They feel so,

They were,

They were so cheated and it makes me feel terrible for them first of all,

But it does make me feel hopeful that we're going to get to those answers faster because that's a whole generation of women that were just like kind of whatever and that's not okay.

I know that there are some doctors that are willing to have those conversations depending on,

You know,

On individual women's health.

And so I think that that's where that menopause provider that is very educated on this part comes into play.

And that's why we have to,

You know,

Bring those to the forefront and share those resources.

Women have questions on how long they can stay on hormones and most of the doctors that are on them say they're staying on them forever.

And then there's the question of if I haven't started it in that 10 year window from the time I went into menopause until now.

So if I went into menopause at 50 just for ease and I'm 62,

Is it too late for me?

And that has to be done with the medical provider,

But I wouldn't say that that option is totally off the table until you talk to a doctor who might be able to tell you otherwise.

Yeah.

I agree with you.

I agree with you.

Well,

This was amazing.

Is there anything else that you want to share anything?

I know there's so much we could go on and on.

Is there anything else though that you'd like to share today?

You know what?

I just want to say thank you.

And if you have questions or you have something in your gut where you feel like it's not right and you've gotten some kind of advice,

Move on to another doctor and don't doubt yourself.

And please take this time for yourself no matter what age you are.

If you're 35,

45,

55,

65,

Take time for yourself,

Please,

Because your health is the most important for the three to take charge of.

So true.

Thanks for being on Tamsen.

Thank you.