Metabolism, Sleep & Energy: Midlife Trifecta W/ Lisa Walker

Hello and welcome everybody to another edition of the podcast.

Today,

I'm talking to the beautiful Lisa Walker from Air Women.

Didn't get it quite right,

Lisa.

How are you?

I'm very well.

Thank you for having me.

I'm so happy to be here.

So am I.

I've been looking forward to this chat.

I've been reading through all of your products and things and I'm like,

Oh,

Let's just dive in here.

So for those people who don't know you already,

Do you want to just introduce yourself and what you do in the world,

Please?

Yeah,

Sure.

I'm Lisa Walker.

So I'm the co-founder of Air Women.

So we are a supplements brand for women over 40.

So we launched February this year,

But my background is very varied.

Lots of advertising,

PR,

Media,

Pharmaceutical,

Imagery.

I was a yoga teacher for 10 years.

So I feel like everything I've done got me to this point.

Isn't that always the way,

Isn't it?

It's like this long winding road that makes no sense at the time.

And then you look back and go,

Oh,

It does make sense.

I love that.

The Steve Jobs quote about,

You know,

It's,

It's only backwards that you see without the dots all connect.

Yeah.

I kind of feel the same.

I'm like,

I don't know if I had so many weird and wonderful adventures and now it's all being brought together.

We were connected through Tori Archbold,

Who has been on the show earlier.

Yeah.

And it's funny because we were just saying before we started recording,

Once I was introduced through Tori,

Then I,

Then I actually heard about you in multiple ways,

Which is very,

Very cool.

I like the universe connects people.

Can you talk to us when you first filled out the form?

I said,

Can you talk about whatever the midlife metamorphosis was and you had quite,

Quite a challenging pivotal moment.

Can you talk to us a little bit about that?

Yeah.

I'll just take a deep breath.

Yeah,

I know.

I feel like I need to,

To,

I'm a crier.

Let's just put it out there.

Yeah,

Me too.

But good.

I mean,

It's good.

Don't hold them back.

No.

Yeah.

So look,

My business partner and I,

Kate started,

Well,

We started working on it in lockdown.

So,

You know,

For quite a,

You know,

Quite a few years before we launched with it,

It takes a long time.

But for me,

The pivotal moment was January 22.

So,

You know,

We've just got through COVID,

We're just getting our lives back to normal.

And then my husband passed away.

So it was very sudden,

Unexpected.

And,

You know,

You're just kind of thrown into a whole world of stuff.

I won't start swearing.

No,

No,

Swear away.

It's just a whole big pile of dog shit.

You know,

I've got two young boys and it's,

You know,

It's just,

I mean,

Look,

You're a mum,

You're,

You just,

You get on with it.

My biggest thing when people say,

You know,

How,

How did all of this happen?

You just get on with it.

You have to.

So I,

You know,

I was very fortunate that at the time I could take some time off work.

The company I was working for at the time were really supportive.

My boss was amazing.

It could have been,

You know,

Completely different.

So I took some time off and then I just focused on work.

But,

You know,

I got to a critical point where I thought,

Well,

Number one,

I had this business going on in the background,

Which I knew I was going to launch,

That we were going to launch at some point.

But also I was juggling kids,

Grief,

Lawyers,

Family,

Friends,

And I could go down a rabbit hole on the legal,

You know,

The joys of dealing with a death in the family.

But,

And we were also selling a company at the time.

So there was just a lot going on.

So I just made that decision to quit,

Focus on myself and my own healing,

Focus on my two boys,

Figure out how we wanted to live the rest of our lives really.

Because you're on that wheel,

You're always on that wheel.

So I took the year off and really focused on air and I needed that for me.

And what was amazing about air is because our purpose is to help women and help women feel better.

It just allowed me to get up every day and be excited.

And I'm a real creative.

So having that creativity,

You know,

Get out,

Get the boys to school,

Get outside,

Do the work on my own health and my own mental health,

So physical and mental,

But then be totally focused on this business and getting it to market was the best way to heal myself.

And I'm just so proud of,

You know,

What we achieved in that process.

I didn't realize that.

Yeah.

And I didn't actually realize how recently your husband passed away.

So thank you for being brave and willing to go there when it's so fresh.

I,

I have a friend in Canberra who also lost her husband unexpectedly,

And she still is dealing with the paperwork,

You know,

Eight years on,

She's getting her son a passport.

What do you say about the parent on the passport?

Do you like that?

There's just a never ending.

Like re like smack in the faceness of like,

Oh,

Okay,

How does this work?

Or do I have to explain to someone else or blah,

Blah,

Blah,

Blah.

And she just asked the question and they don't,

You know,

People don't mean anything,

But it was like,

I just took my boys overseas not long ago,

But as part of that process,

I'm like,

Oh,

I need to pack,

You know,

With all of our documents,

A death certificate.

Wow.

It's just,

You think,

You know,

I'm leaving the country with kids and you just never know if they're going to ask you,

Are you allowed to take your children out of the country?

And I was in the bank last week and depositing a check that was addressed to both of us.

And you know,

We need your husband's signature on that.

And I was like,

Well,

I'd love to,

But he's dead.

So,

Yeah.

And then you have to deal with the reaction of people.

I'm sorry.

I didn't mean it to come across like that,

But you know,

I've just been in this branch so many times we've been through all of this.

You've got every little thing.

You shouldn't be asking me these questions,

But I'm sorry.

It's sometimes I just feel like I need to take a break.

Yeah.

Enormous,

Enormous.

When something like this happens and it's unexpected,

I'm just,

I'm,

I always try and put myself in some way,

Which of course I cannot because I've not been through this,

But I imagine that in your mind,

You have,

This is what the future looks like,

Or this is what we might do.

And this is,

You know,

As the kids grow up,

These are the things we will do as a family.

What,

What happens to your sense of,

I don't know,

Self and future kind of anchoring when something that enormous happens and.

Well,

Look,

I think I was pretty clear on what I wanted.

I think that the hardest part and,

You know,

I made some really big life changes.

So not only the business and changing my career path,

But I,

I moved the boys and I,

We moved to a completely different part of Sydney.

I moved the boys to a new school this year.

And I made some really big changes that I just felt were right for all of us.

And they have been absolutely been the right changes,

But the hardest part of that was the,

The judgment from everyone around you,

Because I don't know,

It's gravy.

And I think part of grief and we could just go down a rabbit hole here,

But you know,

It's judgment of myself.

So I was just in that focus.

Let's just get on with it.

Let's let's do what I need to do.

But then you've got people,

You know,

Am I,

Am I sad enough in front of these people?

Should I be saying this?

Am I,

Should I know it's every little element is I don't know,

Am I,

Am I doing,

Am I,

Am I processing grief the right way?

Am I,

Because people do,

You know,

They don't see you when you're in the dark holes,

Because you try and keep that private,

But then you go out and openly try and be a happy person,

Particularly judge.

And then you feel,

And you might not be,

But you feel like you've been judged.

And then there were also other people that surprised me because they couldn't be around me because,

You know,

People I needed the support from would,

I was in a reminder of my husband.

So there's a lot of people who I just felt like,

Oh,

Wow,

I expected a little bit more.

But I think I,

You know,

Overall,

You just,

You learn a lot about people.

And I think I,

You know,

I'm quite,

I can sit in my emotions and I can sit and process.

And,

You know,

I think I had the tool because I taught yoga for so many years.

I feel like I had a lot of those tools inside me to help process.

And what I've realized is other people don't have those tools.

But I spent a lot of time watching,

Watching my reactions and watching other people's reactions,

And then trying to take that ego and judgment,

Everything going on around me.

If that makes sense.

Yeah,

It does.

I'm actually in the middle of working with a lady who's a healer.

And one of the things that she is talking about with the work that we're doing is that we have these doorways of destiny.

And often they come in these awful,

Shocking,

Slash traumatic,

Slash unexpected twists and turns.

And the way that she talks about,

I don't know why I've got my sexy 1800 voice on this morning.

One of the things that she talks about,

Though,

Is that each one of these doorways to destiny is a call to become more connected to yourself,

Your truth in internally,

And less connected to the voice of the ego and the judgment and the layers of what everyone else externally is sort of seeing doing and reacting.

And I think that's so true.

I've found that in my,

My own experience as well.

But it sounds like for you,

This was also it gave you a clarity and having a purpose of air.

Yeah,

Having already started gave you something to kind of,

And I don't know whether is it the right word anchor or something to like a reason to be enthused and connected to something outside of dealing with?

Yeah,

I think there's so many layers.

So I think a big part of it is yes,

It was surprised and I'm not going to go into detail,

But it wasn't as much of a surprise to me as it was.

Right.

So I had had a low level anxiety for many years about what might occur.

Right.

So in many ways,

My worst fears came true.

But to add another layer,

I think there's a big part of then being in your forties and getting to a point where you're comfortable enough in yourself to not give a shit what other people think.

Yeah.

You've got all of these other layers coming on.

So if this had happened in my thirties,

I probably would handle it really differently.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Because there is that element of,

Right.

I'm in my forties.

I don't care what people think about me anymore.

This has happened to my family.

Therefore,

This is the number one is my family.

Yeah.

Number two is,

Yes,

I've got this amazing purpose that I wanted to find.

And so a big part of what I love to talk about now is yes,

Is air and I love air,

But it's also about midlife health and finding a new purpose for the second half of your life,

Because that providing that mental health,

Moving forward into the rest of your life is so important.

So that's where I think,

You know,

All of these,

Yes,

It's a big pile of shit,

But at the same time,

It's all hit at this time where it's this crossroad and I've found exactly where I need to be.

Yeah.

It's perfect.

And I'm really forthright in how I feel about helping women find that as well.

Yeah.

So good.

I think there's a lot of women out there who similar to me,

Like I've always had pretty good health.

I,

My filter of getting older is my dad who,

You know,

Died at 91,

Having still been driving a car and walking,

You know,

Kilometers in a day and all of those things.

And then I got to 47 and all of a sudden this big,

Natural,

You know,

Vital sort of get up and go-ness in me kind of started,

You know,

And a whole heap of little bits and pieces have started showing up.

And I have been so clear in my own understanding that this is a fork in the road where you can either step up your self-care and your mental,

Physical,

Emotional,

Spiritual tending to yourself and drastically influence the trajectory of the second half of your life,

Or you can go in the other direction.

So you're speaking my language because I feel like I'm being called to,

It's like,

Okay,

Hang on a minute.

This is not a sustainable habit or,

You know,

Something's showing up.

I've got a genetic joint condition,

But I didn't even know I had it until oestrogen started dropping.

And because collagen and oestrogen play,

It's made it a lot worse.

And I'm like,

Ah,

So I feel like I'm at that crossroads as well of like,

Like calling to arms of like,

Are you going to step it up or are you going to go,

Oh,

I'm going to follow this old tired sort of like,

Oh,

You know,

The older we get,

The worse our health gets,

The more tired we get.

And it's just like,

Whoa,

Hang on.

That's not the story that I want to be creating.

So thank heavens for people like you that jump in and go,

Okay,

Here's a different path.

Well,

And it's also because like,

I feel I'm finding myself again.

So I think,

You know,

Like thirties,

Early forties,

If you've got children,

Like you're really in the thick of it,

It's hard to carve out that time,

But at the same time,

That's when your adrenal system's really struggling.

So you've got to take the time.

And this is what I'm,

You know,

Really big advocate of is God,

If I I'm 49 now,

So if I knew at 41,

What I know now probably would have done things so differently,

But I love that the conversation is happening now.

Like I feel like at least this is starting to happen.

So I don't know.

It's just,

You've got to,

I guess where I was going is as you get older into your later forties,

You're not,

Your kids are growing up a little.

So you can start to take time out for yourself a little bit more.

And that's really hard when you've got,

You know,

Two and four year olds,

But as they get older,

You know,

I can,

You can leave your kids at home and go for a walk.

You can,

You know,

They're not,

They understand that,

Okay,

I need 10 minutes to sit outside by myself and just breathe,

Sit in the car,

Which is what I always used to do.

So,

You know,

You just,

You've got to just take those little moments and they might only be little moments.

You don't have to,

I mean,

I am a huge advocate for yoga,

But sometimes taking two hours out of your day to get to a class,

Do an hour and a half and then come home is not possible.

But,

You know,

I'll sit out on my balcony as soon as I wake up in the morning,

Even with my coffee,

Sometimes not,

And just listen to a meditation.

And that might be five minutes.

It might be 20 minutes.

It's,

It's the process of doing it.

And it's not you up for the day,

No matter how short that is.

So I have my rituals and something will work for everybody.

And you just have to find your ritual that works for you.

Yeah.

I totally agree.

I think,

Yeah,

I think when holistic health and self-care was,

Was first having its huge heyday,

It,

I think we ripped women off by focusing on big things like going to a whole yoga class or taking time out to go to a day spa or whatever,

All of those things delicious,

But introducing those little tiny snacks of self-care and even just closing your eyes and going,

Oh,

Okay.

This is the first time that I've actually been in my body.

Cause I find myself very much,

You know,

Neck up,

Particularly if I'm working and really focused on a project that's taking a lot of my,

You know,

Juice and attention.

Um,

And yeah,

Just being able to go,

Oh,

Look,

There's a beautiful day out there.

I might just sit out there for five minutes and breathe.

It makes such a big difference.

And yeah,

Um,

I have had just a ridiculously busy time with my daughter,

Youngest turned 18,

Had heaps of family here,

40 grand finals.

I just,

You know,

One of those just full and I'm like,

My brain is fully fried at the moment.

And I'm just like,

Okay,

What do you need this morning?

You need to actually just sit and breathe and not think about the next thing.

Just be very present.

Perfect timing for our conversation.

So when you think back to the pathway of your life,

How did you like,

Where did the idea come from for air?

And I know that you've got a co-founder as well.

So,

And you used to work together in marketing.

Yeah.

So,

And you talk about on your website,

Like,

You know,

Working alongside a woman who's kind of a similar age juggling like all of the things that we do,

Particularly in our thirties and sort of early forties.

Um,

Where did the idea come from in the first place?

Yeah,

It's really,

Um,

I mean,

It just,

It felt so organic at the time.

So I,

I mean,

I always knew I wanted to do something,

You know,

For myself,

But we were in lockdown and Kate and I,

We were lucky.

We lived within five kilometers of each other.

So we just went out walking,

You know,

10 kilometer walks and,

You know,

We'd worked together for a long time and then we'd actually both left our jobs at that point.

Yeah.

But actually number one,

It cemented our friendship because we spent so many hours together,

But because we talked about everything,

You know,

Sometimes it was with a coffee,

Sometimes it was with a margarita.

So we,

You know,

We did a lot of hours together and we talked about everything,

You know,

Everything that was going on,

You know,

Kate was by my side,

Um,

You know,

Throughout COVID and then after Ben passed away,

But at the time we just kept coming back to,

Holy shit,

What's going on?

How do we feel?

And,

You know,

We talked about then how our friends are feeling.

We all felt like we were drowning under this mental load.

Yes.

Um,

We were,

You know,

Just slowly gaining a little bit of weight,

No matter what we did,

You know,

Exercising even more than we'd ever done.

Yep.

Really healthy.

You know,

You talked about the rage,

You know,

Going on and then,

You know,

We talked,

But then,

You know,

At the same time we were having conversations with our friends about the same things and we kept coming back to think there's got to be something that we can do.

Yeah.

And then we researched all the products that were out there,

All of the ingredients,

And we just thought,

God,

This is just shit.

So,

You know,

I don't want,

I mean,

The best products,

You know,

And I still firmly believe there's so many different ways through your forties and into perimenopause.

Our way is one of them,

But,

And there are a lot of supplements out there and some of them are really good and some of them really work,

But did they talk to us?

No,

They were,

You know,

The big brands want you to buy 20 different products,

But they make a lot of money.

Then there are some other good ones,

But they're naming,

You know,

I'm reluctant to one under the bus,

But the naming conventions are just so full of fear mongering for women.

And that's just not who we are.

And they're like,

They're clearly not made by women and not made by women,

Our age.

So,

And I've got a beauty background as well.

So our,

What we really wanted was something that spoke to us,

Had number one was efficacious.

They had to work.

So we,

And we worked with a naturopath and nutritionist.

So we only,

We don't have any more than 10 ingredients because our number one was they had to work.

So they had to have clinical doses,

Every ingredient so that every ingredient worked really hard.

You know,

There's a lot of brands who just put a little smidge of something in so they can make a marketing claim.

Yep.

And a whole heap of fillers that stop you absorbing anything anyway.

Yeah.

And then we wanted product,

The product names to make us good and positive and talked about the outcome,

Not the,

You know,

Not the challenge.

We wanted something that you'd be happy to leave out.

So that had to look good,

Had to,

You know,

Our,

You know,

Our key products show up,

Which we just love the name,

You know,

It helps you show up for everything that's important to you,

But equally it balances hormones,

But you can take it to work and leave it on your desk and it still looks amazing and you're not going to hide it.

So the best supplement you can take is one you're going to remember to take every day.

Yep.

If it's called calm or hormones and you're hiding it away from everyone that you might see.

So that was number one.

It just,

They have to work.

They had to make us feel good and they had to be something that women were proud of.

Yeah.

And that's where we came from and,

And also simplify.

So we just wanted one supplement for the morning,

One for night that easily fits within your beauty regime.

Yes.

And then the way we're building around that is boosters,

Which we say,

You know,

If you need a retinol for your skin,

Then it's the same kind of thing.

So we'd zipped is if you're looking for something to boost metabolism,

We've got a product for that.

Yeah.

And then that will happen as we roll out new products as well.

So we're still anchored by two key products work together really well,

But then you've got these booster products,

Which will be just what you need personally.

Yeah.

I just love,

I,

When,

When we first booked this interview,

I'd been on your website anyway,

But just reacquainting myself this morning,

I'm just like,

You've done such a beautiful job of positively framing and the packaging is gorgeous.

And I'm like,

Oh my goodness,

That looks like,

Like a high end beauty brand,

You know,

Beautiful,

You know,

Luxury mask or something.

That's what,

That's the vibe that I get.

So I'm like,

Yeah,

You can tell these girls have been in marketing and experiential too.

Right.

You know,

Our box is beautiful and I've got them behind me in this beautiful black glass bottles,

But then the tablets are the same color as the passion.

So they're beautiful colors.

They just look,

You know,

And even when we go,

You know,

You can go traveling,

You can just throw them all in the same bag because they're all different colors.

And it's just,

It's all about simplicity because I mean,

I don't know about you,

But I don't have time to think about it.

I don't want,

You know,

And I'm blind,

I take my glasses off,

I can't see a thing.

I'm so blind.

I don't want to be trying to work out what pill does not.

I just want to make it easy,

Set and forget,

Move on with the rest of my day.

So,

So that's how we've just thought about the whole process around the brand.

And then the other bit we love is it allows us to talk about what we want and what women want and to bring positive talk to hormonal changes in your forties and just living your life in your forties.

And that's,

You know,

So much as fear mongering.

And,

You know,

If I can get one thing out of my whole life that I'll be proud of,

It's a women to stop apologizing for their hormones.

Yes.

Oh my goodness.

Because I'm bloody well sick of it.

I was just having a conversation.

We always have hormones.

Men have hormones.

Hormones run our life.

We just need to stop apologizing because it's a superpower.

Yeah,

Exactly.

I was just having a kind of pre podcast chat with a lady who is a psychotherapist and counselor.

And she was talking about how that the negative patriarchal view of women and their,

Excuse me,

Hormones and hysteria,

Like any,

Any kind of female weakness in inverted commas was seen as like hormonally driven.

It was hysteria.

It was wrong.

It was whatever.

And it's like,

If you actually just listened to all the messages that these beautiful hormones were bringing you,

They're the key to,

And I,

Excuse me,

I've studied a lot of traditional Chinese medicine and same thing.

It's like,

We have cycles in our lives.

This is just another transition point,

But there's a purpose.

And I totally agree.

We need to be positively reframing and yes,

Being real about some of the things that can be destabilizing or discombobulating or whatever,

But also being like,

This is an exciting time where,

You know,

We do get,

My girls have just turned 18 and 19.

So I feel like I'm on this cusp of this huge,

Like all of a sudden the hands-on parenting is not there.

They're not even in my house anymore.

And I'm just like,

Oh,

All this space to sort of reconnect to who I am and what I want.

And you know,

What,

What my values are because,

You know,

That rearing and protecting of the young takes up so much emotional bandwidth.

And yeah,

I was having a chat with a friend the other day,

She's pregnant with her second.

And I was just watching,

I was sitting,

Having a coffee and a beautiful breakfast underneath the tree,

Doing a little bit of work on my laptop.

And she is literally running crazy around this two-year-old in this like playground part of the cafe.

And I thought,

We just don't realize how insanely demanding those years are,

I think,

Until we're at the other end of things or looking at someone else doing it.

And I just think,

How did we even?

Well,

I have two boys,

So that has not changed.

Mine are 10 and 13 and they still just wrestle.

That's all they do.

They wrestle for fun or to kill each other.

Somewhere in between is a happy medium.

But,

You know,

I just went away and I did a whole reel of just,

My friends,

I was,

We were exhausted.

I'm like,

But this is my life.

I just have to turn my back and watch because otherwise it stresses me out.

But it's just,

It's just boys,

You know,

Two boys and puppies together.

You just have to let them go.

Yeah.

Just be who they are.

I think that's,

Yeah.

Otherwise we can't exhaust ourselves.

And I'm interested,

I was reading a book just recently.

And one of the things that the person said,

She's a psychiatrist.

One of the things that she said was,

Estrogen is the hormone of accommodation.

And I was like,

That makes a lot of sense for a lot of things.

What do you,

Because you mentioned before,

Like in your late forties,

It's like,

I know who I am.

This is what I need to do.

I don't really care whether people like it or whatever.

What else has shifted for you in your own midlife transition from kind of the,

You know,

Doing things because you believe you should,

Or has that never been an issue for you?

Because there is some people that never do that.

It's always been an issue.

I think in your thirties,

I think it's the hardest decade to get through.

There's just so much societal pressure on everything that you put on yourself.

So I think being in your forties is just completely freeing.

You know,

It's the best time.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

What patterns do you see in the community that you're growing around,

Where people are like,

When they're,

When they're meeting and they're having those conversations,

Or even in your friends group.

Yeah.

I feel like my group of friends is kind of,

We're just figuring out that this is a really good thing.

Like a really powerful,

Magnetic,

You know,

Juicy time of our lives.

And,

And I feel like it's like some secret that no one's let us in on.

I know the whole thing is like now,

Okay,

Right.

I've got this big list of things I want to do.

Like,

You know,

Kate and I are both going to start pole dancing.

So exciting to do that.

And,

You know,

I just,

There's just so many things that I'm like,

Oh,

Let's just bloody give it a go.

And I think for me,

And I've always been,

You know,

Being on exercise and fitness.

But now I just want to do things that challenge my brain a bit,

You know,

Physical,

But challenge my thinking or challenge the way I've done things in the past.

Yeah.

And I think that's really freeing.

Yeah.

Because part of it is that I don't care what people think anymore.

But as far as conversations,

Yes,

It's absolutely happening.

And I'm just excited that those conversations happen.

And who would have,

You know,

I never would have thought that three years ago,

That now I'd be talking to friends about which vibrators we own.

Yes.

It's so good.

I think,

You know,

And that,

You know,

And sexual health and talking about that.

It's really important.

And I think,

If anything,

Most of the women I know now,

And even conversations through the community with air,

But also with our friends is that those conversations have got a million times more honest.

Yes.

Than they were.

And even with some male friends as well.

Do you know,

I posted something on LinkedIn a while ago about air and just saying that I had a conversation with a friend.

Yes.

And,

You know,

She's really excited because she's finally she's actually been taking them and she's interested in sex again.

Yeah.

I didn't say who it was,

But then her husband,

And he's like,

Nice post on LinkedIn.

And then I'm like,

Well,

You're not meant to like,

Well,

How do you know it's you?

And then another male friend also messaged me saying,

Hey,

I really like what you wrote.

And I feel like saying,

Okay,

So go out and buy them for your wife.

You're doing yourself a favor.

Yeah.

But I think,

You know,

That those conversations too are great because it's,

You know,

I think you get to,

If things feel so buried and hidden for so long and the fact that everyone feels this freedom now,

Male and female to talk about it a little bit more is mind blowing.

It's great.

I know.

I love,

I,

I mean,

I've always had a strong like status quo challenging or,

You know,

Rebel part of me anyway,

But I feel like all the conversations that we're having about menopause,

It's like the last or the,

It's not the last thing,

But it's one of the final taboo things that,

You know,

We,

We broke through the period thing.

We broke through,

You know,

Sexual complete ridiculous or traumatic behavior with me too.

Like all of those,

Like so many things have been called out,

Called out,

Called out.

And it's like,

Now we're at this last frontier of like,

Let's talk about all of the things that happen in midlife.

And let's talk about,

You know,

That there,

You don't have to have a decline in your sex drive.

If you don't want to,

I mean,

Some people are like,

Yeah,

I'm good.

I'm,

I'm done.

I,

I don't really care,

But having these conversations at least opens the field of possibilities for people.

Cause it's like,

We may just be thinking,

Oh,

This is just what happens.

And I don't think it's helped by the fact that doctors are so a lot of doctors are not very well versed informed,

Particularly not about holistic solutions or lifestyle influence factors.

Yeah.

And I think that's probably the hardest one is how do you have those conversations?

And it's not,

You know,

A lot of doctors aren't really across it.

Yeah.

I mean,

Again,

I think it's starting to,

I think that because those conversations are happening,

You know,

There's definitely,

You know,

Some women's health specialists that are more interested in it.

You know,

We,

You know,

We have our naturopath and nutritionist and she was the one who started talking to us about vaginal atrophy and yes,

The worst word.

I know it's awful.

Isn't it?

She was the one who was like,

You've got to use it or lose it.

And I'm like,

Right,

What do I need to go?

Because,

You know,

Obviously I'm on my own now.

Yeah.

What do I need?

Yeah.

I'm not really dating.

Yeah.

Okay.

How do I address this?

Yeah,

Exactly.

And I did an interview,

Oh geez,

Probably about six months ago with Dr.

Ginny Mansberg who,

You know,

Yeah.

And she was just like,

I don't care whether you're on HRT or not,

But you've just got to be understanding that once you lose that vaginal,

You know,

Juiciness,

Not coming back.

Yeah.

You need to intervene.

Yeah.

And that was the first time that I,

Like,

I didn't realize that,

You know,

It's kind of like,

God,

The word in my head is like lost cause.

That's not what I want to say.

But what I mean is it's not reversible.

Like if you allow the atrophy to happen and quite apart from all of the sexual function stuff,

Like the,

You know,

The genital itching or needing to wee all the time or UTIs or whatever.

Yeah.

That can come from that.

It's like,

No one needs to be living like that.

That is not a comfortable place to be living.

And that's why we need to talk about it because you wouldn't know.

I didn't.

And I'm like,

You know,

I always think,

I mean,

It's a long time since I've been a practicing biologist,

But I'm like,

I'm a biologist and perimenopause was like,

What is this?

I wasn't expecting this.

I just thought my periods would stop one day.

And now I'm like,

I was so,

So,

Um,

Yeah,

No,

Right.

Wouldn't that be,

Be like,

And the end little button,

You just push it.

Yeah.

Um,

I'm interested when you,

Um,

Started working with the naturopath and the nutritionist,

What was the,

There's obviously it's a,

It's a huge thing to start,

You know,

A supplement.

It's like,

Where do you even start with the process?

Did you just start with the key things that you and your circle and the people that you were connected to were experiencing or I'm a scientist in me wants to know.

I mean,

I've got a biology degree as well.

So full circle.

Um,

And my mom is a naturopath and Kay's dad was a GP.

So we'd always be,

Yeah,

Yeah,

Yeah,

Yeah.

The first thing,

So Kate and I did a lot of research.

So,

And I was really lucky.

We,

You know,

Um,

My family and I,

We owned a media company,

So I had access to doing a lot of surveys and research out there.

So we started with that,

Um,

Because at the time we were talking about perimenopause.

Yes.

But what we figured out through all of the,

This surveying of about 4,

000 women was the number one thing.

First of all,

They think that people think that,

Um,

Perimenopause is when you spend mental,

You know,

Going through medical pause is the really hard,

Fast,

Identifiable symptoms,

Hot flashes,

Night sweats.

So when we did our research and we focused on,

You know,

Every really 35 to 55,

But if I'm around 45 and number one things that women were interested in,

Well had challenges with energy,

Sleep,

Metabolism.

Yep.

Um,

But what they don't realize is that most of that is caused by number one,

Your busy life.

So your adrenal system,

But it also,

It is then impacting hormones.

So we really,

So that's why our focus is all,

You know,

We talk about us being really supportive of your adrenal system.

Yes.

That's our number one is stress and all of our products have got ingredients to help with stress.

So that's where we,

Even in our world,

We talk about that holistic body and looking after your body.

It's not,

You know,

Yes,

Hormones play a big part of it,

But it's everything else that's going on in your life.

A hundred percent.

Yeah.

All the patterns that you've been doing when you have unending energy.

Yeah.

Well,

Perfectionism we're trying to,

You know,

No,

No,

No.

So then we had these three kind of really big core pillars and then so menopause symptoms was literally number 10 on the list of what women were worried about.

And we thought,

Wow,

This is interesting.

So it's either that menopause symptoms aren't identified by women or there's just bigger things at play.

So then we just,

We really focused on those pillars.

It's energy,

Brain fog,

Hormonal,

Which is really show up.

Then it's sleep,

Sleep,

Getting to sleep,

But also staying,

Staying asleep.

That was something that was huge for me.

And I'm an ex sleep scientist and I'm like,

I'm doing everything I should.

Yeah.

And again,

It's very linked to stress.

And then what we put in with that one as well is about muscle health,

Because out of it is we're exercising so much,

But if you can also calm those muscles down,

I've always had restless legs.

So that was something we spoke about as well.

And then of course we couldn't do anything without metabolism because number one,

I don't know any woman in the history of women who is,

You know,

Not thinking about their metabolism or bloating,

You know,

It's not about weight loss.

It's just about making yourself feel helping feel a bit lighter,

You know,

Bloating,

Digestion,

It's metabolism.

So that's where we got to those pillars.

And then we,

We found a naturopath and nutritionist,

Kristen Beck,

Who she's amazing.

She,

You know,

She teaches nutrition as well.

She is late forties as well.

So she knew exactly where we were coming from with the range,

Has a lot of experience in this realm.

So we worked with her really closely on them,

What we needed to do with the formulations and ideally what we put into each formulation.

And of course,

You know,

It needed a little bit of tweaking.

And then we worked with another regulatory specialist who's also a naturopath access to,

Okay,

This is the new ingredients coming in and they play better together in a supplement.

So that's kind of how we got that,

You know,

It's a full group.

So cool.

What a journey.

Fun though.

It must feel very satisfying to have gone through all of those things.

And I so appreciate that you started by asking women,

You know,

Like not just because as you said before,

I can't help but think when,

When you go to,

You know,

Massive,

Big discount chemist and you've got all those supplements there,

The labeling's awful,

But like you said,

They're very like,

You know,

Stop being a bitchy moody person,

Like very alarmist and negatively,

I don't know,

Positioned,

I guess is the way.

It's all anchored in fear.

It's like,

I've got a friend who just moved on to ours,

But she was using another brand.

And she's like,

I'm too scared to go off it.

And I'm like,

But you know,

Off that she's just to switch to a different brand.

But again,

It's just,

It's because all of their messaging is all anchored in fear and and it's,

But it shows how much women have become reliant on what they're taking,

Which is good,

Because it means they work,

But she has switched and she's like,

Perfect.

This is even better.

So,

I mean,

The other really phenomenal part of what we're doing is just the reviews that we're getting and,

You know,

We're working really slow.

You know,

We're not,

You know,

Obviously we're trying to do everything organically.

We want everything to be real.

But,

You know,

I think out of all of our reviews,

I've got one four star review.

Everything else is five stars.

Yeah.

I've been looking,

I'm like,

Whoa,

It's like crazy good testimonials.

So,

Yeah.

And that I mean that,

You know,

If anything,

I'm like,

Oh,

Wow,

That's you know,

It just makes you feel really good because they're real.

So good.

So good.

And what I'm interested,

Why have you decided to.

It sounds like you're wanting to do a more slow,

Organic,

Sustainable way of launching rather than the big.

I mean,

Obviously,

I don't know,

But I'm imagining it takes an enormous amount of money to do a huge,

Big launch as well.

So obviously that might be part of the reason.

But was was that a conscious decision by you guys just to do it in a more gentle way?

Yeah.

Approach things differently.

Yeah.

It's definitely a bit of a groundswell.

So we did launch and we put money behind it.

But,

You know,

We're fully funded it ourselves.

So we have been approached by,

You know,

Some investment companies and some other brands.

And so far we've said,

No,

We just want to do it our way and have that full control.

Supplements are very expensive to produce.

The BGA regulatory side in Australia is really full on.

So,

Again,

Very expensive.

So,

You know,

Yes,

We're doing it slow.

We've gone into Mr.

Vitamins.

So we are in one Sydney group.

And again,

You know,

We've just gone in there and we want to we just want to do it slow and do it our way.

And,

You know,

I've worked for big corporates where you've got big sales targets.

And to make those targets,

Sometimes you're not making the right decisions.

Yeah.

Do it.

So it's really important to us to do it in the way that we've got control of that we know is right.

Everything that every decision we make is about doing what we know is right for the brand,

Not only being,

You know,

Brand strategist.

Yes.

Yeah,

Of course.

But also for the products and the women that we want to that we want to speak to.

And I think the big part of it is we want to our whole purpose is to make women feel more like themselves.

Yeah.

Where that will go.

You know,

It might move into other phases of life because we still feel like there's other phases of life that are done properly.

Definitely.

Yes.

All the key transitions for women,

For girls,

Women.

Definitely.

You know,

And we've got lots of formulations ready to go.

I think at the moment it's just doing it at the right time and doing it our way,

Which is a bit slower.

Yeah.

No,

That's why I asked.

I'm curious because I just.

I don't know,

I really like the whole energy that the brand feels like,

Obviously brand strategy.

Very,

Very well done.

But it doesn't feel like it's like if you don't take this,

You're going to,

You know,

Like it's a very different feeling,

You know,

Than all of those things.

And I'm just like,

Yes,

I'm interested in this recommendation.

You know,

Someone.

Exactly.

What do you else say at a mouth that is,

You know,

That's the ultimate way.

Absolutely.

So when you feel into what's next for the brand,

Is it.

Introducing those new formulations for different transition points or do you have other things that you're I'm sure you've got lots of ideas,

But what's next?

Yeah,

We definitely want to start talking about women's sexual health.

That's really.

So that's one product we're looking at just some others.

Probably the next couple would just be a couple of simpler products.

Yeah.

Possibly not.

Yeah.

Hopefully before Christmas,

A couple of products to come out.

And then next year,

Like we have a full pipeline.

It's,

It's just when and how much.

Yeah,

Definitely.

You know,

Talking more about libido and sexual health.

We are next one off the block might be one for teenage girls.

Yeah.

Because it is it's women our age actually buying them for their daughters.

And,

You know,

I feel like any woman in their forties who has a teenage girl in their household.

Yep.

That's one thing you won't have to do.

Yeah.

So,

You know,

There's definitely,

I think,

You know,

We've got a GP is very keen on us to do something around pregnancy.

I'm really passionate about post-pregnancy the fatigue and to talk about adrenal depletion.

My girls are 12 months apart.

And I look back and go,

You would have been like my adrenals probably just like checked out,

I think for a few years.

That's like full time.

And both my boys are eight months old,

Like goodness gracious.

Yeah.

There's a lot there's,

You know,

It's,

It's how deep do we want the range to be for women 40 plus,

Because we don't,

There's lots of products we could do,

But equally,

I don't want to take 20 tablets a day and nobody else wants to either.

So I think that's where we've got things like our boosters that are actually appropriate for any,

Actually,

All of our products can be used for any age.

I mean,

If you've got,

If you're in your twenties and you have really to go,

You know,

You've got PMS,

Yes,

We'll show up,

We'll work well for you as well.

Yeah.

It's just that,

You know,

We're really focused on this phase of life because we know that nobody is talking to anyone.

Yeah.

Yeah,

Absolutely.

So,

Yeah.

So good.

It's so good.

It's so beautiful to spend time with someone who is really,

Really living something that's purposeful and important to you,

Because I feel like that's the great invitation of this time in our lives as well.

It's like,

If we think about holistic health,

I know we talk a lot about,

You know,

Sleep and nutrition and movement and all of those things,

But purpose is just as important as that.

And,

You know,

Doing something that you care about,

That's aligned to your value system.

And I think that's definitely been part of my journey of like waking up to the fact that some things that I was choosing to spend time on were so not aligned to my value system.

I was just kind of doing them because I thought I should.

And yeah,

I just feel like the more women who are choosing purpose,

Choosing values,

Choosing,

You know,

To be the,

The steerer,

Steerer,

That's not a very good way,

But you know what I mean?

You know,

Steering consciously.

You absolutely have to,

Because then what happens when your kids,

You know,

If you've got children,

What happens when they grow up and you need,

You know,

You've just got to find your next thing because we live so much longer now.

And yes,

You've got this whole other life that you need to get ready for.

And that's exciting.

Yeah.

Throw out everything that you've been in the past,

Because you can let all of that go and just see what you want to be.

Yeah.

Ultimate freedom.

That's what I feel like at the moment.

I have complete control over my time,

Everything that I invest.

Exciting.

Something that's been calling to me,

My dad,

I'm a Murphy by birth and my dad is from Ireland and I've never been to Europe.

So I'm like,

I think a solo travel adventure is on my list of,

Cause I,

I love being by myself in a new place where I can just put sand shoes on and head out the front door and go left or right.

And just like with no plan,

That's how I,

I spent a month in New York many years ago now,

But by myself just after my dad died.

And it was just such a,

I mean,

It was such a time of like the first time I hadn't been with my kids and my dad.

Yeah.

But just,

You know,

Putting on shoes.

And I,

I remember I was just talking to,

To,

Um,

My girls about this.

I remember being on one of those double-decker buses in New York and it was raining.

I'd been to yoga at like eight o'clock that morning and I was still out.

I'd gone to a show and whatever.

I still have my yoga mat with me and I've got my yoga mat above my head on top of the bus.

Cause it's raining and I'm just like,

This is the best thing ever.

I was just so.

And,

Um,

I think it's really important to reconnect with those things that,

Yeah.

Open up that joy inside of us.

Cause yeah,

I think I,

I got a bit,

A bit boring and a bit disconnected from my life.

You're just,

You're just getting through each day.

Yeah.

It's the daily grind though.

I mean,

You have to do at the time,

But if I think it's just having that mentality that you doesn't always,

It's not always going to be like that.

And yes,

You might be in the thick of it.

And yes,

You've got a million,

You've got little people and businesses and partners all crying out for your attention,

But it's not going to last forever.

No,

It really doesn't.

That's what I said to that friend.

Yeah.

And your purpose changes.

You don't have to find one purpose.

That is the rest of your life.

Your purpose can change at any point.

And that is with little people and family.

And I don't know,

Like for me,

Major launches and work,

If that all happens,

But then also be open to change and open to having,

You know,

My purpose for the next 12 months might be this,

But I could change my purpose after that,

Who knows,

But it's just being open and discussing and challenging your brain.

Do you know,

I love,

I've been just getting back into reading.

I mean,

I studied biology and ecology at university and who knows how I ended up where I ended up,

But I'm really enjoying getting back into some of those books.

And yes,

Got back into some of the yoga philosophy books months ago.

And even when I studied yoga,

I wasn't that big into the philosophy behind it.

Whereas now I feel like my brain's got more space to think about that.

So,

You know,

It's just,

Again,

I'm,

You know,

I'm really,

I'm finding space to find interest in different things.

So I'm just going with it.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Follow the spark of inspiration.

I love that feeling of feeling really engaged with something that's new and it's I'm stuck.

I don't know why,

But I decided to study just to set for in training and assessment,

Which I thought would be like an absolute breeze.

Oh my God,

It's more work than a bloody masters.

But it's,

It's really good.

Cause it's,

It's something that I've like,

I've taught and created courses my entire life.

Like always sort of been communications or education or something like that,

But the actual principles of instructional design and particularly how to help people with literacy and learning and numeracy gaps,

And it's all new and I can feel my brain going,

Ooh,

Ooh,

Exciting.

Like,

You know,

Like rewiring or unwiring or whatever,

Like challenging what I thought,

Or,

You know,

I love that,

That feeling of my dad was very much like that too.

Like he was always.

Yeah.

Trying something new,

Starting something new,

Reading something new at 91,

You know,

He was still very,

Yeah,

Very engaged and growing his brain.

And in the end he said to me when he was paliating,

He's like,

Well,

If I thought that my body would wear out before my brain did,

I might not have taken so much good use of my,

You know,

Good care of my brain.

I was like,

Well,

I still think that's preferable.

I think there's so much pleasure in learning something that is just out of interest.

You know,

I went back to uni and did masters in marketing and there's not as much pleasure in that as doing something that is completely different to your everyday.

Yeah.

Yeah.

And I think that's what I would encourage people to do.

Something drives your interest,

You know,

Re I'm reading a book I've been wanting to read for years and years and I forgot about it,

Which is the secret life of trees.

And it's just about how smart trees are and how they talk to each other.

And it's just beautiful.

And I just,

You know,

I'm getting so much pleasure out of something that had been on my list many,

Many years ago.

And,

You know,

I've just found something different,

But I'm learning and it's,

And it's not to do with my day to day.

It's not about,

It's not attached.

Yeah.

You're with my kids and,

But you know,

Learning,

Learning for pleasure is really important.

Yeah,

Absolutely.

Absolutely.

Oh,

The book,

I just read the upgrade.

I want to read that too.

It's an amazing book.

I highly recommend,

But she talks about how important connection and learning new stuff is for your brain health.

Um,

Yeah.

So like overwhelmingly longevity is connected to connection and that,

Yeah,

Doing things new,

Challenging your brain,

Keeping that like,

You know,

Cognitive processing machines still working.

Like we said,

Lose it or use it,

Use it or lose it.

There's gotta be things you find interesting.

Yeah,

Exactly.

Well,

All of those beautiful people out there going,

I need to check out these supplements.

They sound like they're just what I need,

Which is me,

Including where can we find air women and yourself online?

Um,

So we're at airwomen.

Com.

Au.

So we're mostly sold online at the moment where,

You know,

We're just starting to talk to distribution,

Um,

Places.

So we're in Mr.

Vitamins,

Which is a Sydney chain at five stores.

Uh,

But other than that online at the moment,

And that is the best place to find us for,

You know,

Community and then talking about,

Um,

As much as we like to talk about,

Sometimes we talk about some random things,

But you know,

It's all new stuff.

That's good for brains.

Yeah.

Thank you so much,

Lisa.

I will put all of the,

Um,

Links that you've just mentioned in the show notes as well.

It's been really lovely to connect and learn more about your journey.

I feel like,

Yeah,

It's,

It's a funny reminder,

Isn't it?

When you talk to other people that lives have gone in this sort of seemingly disconnected,

But then come back to a perfect,

Yeah.

Perfect purpose point.

Yeah,

Exactly.

Thank you so much for your time.

Thank you so much.

It's so lovely to chat to you.

Bye-bye.

Bye.