Hello and welcome to Griefing with Julia Goh.
Episode number three,
Baby loss and why is it different from any other loss.
I am Julia.
I am a informational grief and growth coach.
I am also a bereaved mom.
My son died in February 2016.
He was born prematurely and he died in my arms three days later.
And that was a really challenging time for me.
And since then I've been on a healing journey.
I learned to love my life again.
I learned to love myself again.
I learned many tools and I became certified.
So I could help other women who experience the same professionally,
But also with my personal experience to heal,
To grow and to have this support that I wanted when I lost my son,
Someone who understands someone who gets it,
Who also knows how to move forward in the time that I need or with the resources I have in myself too.
Today's episode is really dear to my heart.
I actually recorded it in 2018 and I started my podcast there,
Heal your heart after baby loss,
But of course life happened and it got a little bit shaky.
I stopped and I am back now,
But this episode actually was really valuable and I want to share it.
I added it a few things.
So in the end of the episode,
You will get a snippet about or snippet from myself from that episode that I cut out of the episode,
But I wanted to share it now with you because it feels really vulnerable.
And yeah,
You will you will listen to it.
I hope this episode gives you some words for what you experience and helps you maybe you can also share it with other people that are in the same situation and especially other people that are not in the same situation,
People who might need this episode to actually understand what is going on for you because maybe it is difficult for you to express it.
And yeah,
I will without further ado let you listen to the episode.
Losing a loved one is never easy.
Pain,
Questions,
Guilt,
Regrets,
But also love and memories.
Memories?
Well,
When my grandma died,
I was shocked.
It came unexpected,
But I know that she has had a life.
I was grieving,
But I could let her go knowing that she lived remembering her,
Cherishing our time together,
Sharing the experiences with her with others.
Parties that we experience,
Talking about her character,
Talking about her life.
Losing a baby is different,
No memories of the life we lived together,
Nothing to talk about with family members,
No experience to share.
You can't think back and talk about that birthday party and how your grandma danced the camcun and everyone was having so much fun together and can't talk about her quirks,
Something there is like where she was weird or where she got angry.
You don't have experiences to share,
You don't have stories to share.
When you lose a child,
You might have people around you who can't understand you grief,
Just because of that.
There might be people who tell you,
Well,
Don't be sad,
You didn't even know the child,
Why do you miss him,
Why do you miss her?
Or you know,
Don't worry,
You can have more children.
Who would ever say that if your husband died?
Don't worry,
You can have another husband,
Don't be sad.
Knowing that,
I don't want to put judgement on people who don't understand.
It's hard to understand what you're going through for people who never experienced pregnancy or baby loss.
Your baby will never see the sun,
The moon,
You will never hold it in your arms,
Kiss its forehead,
Dry its tears.
A child dying doesn't fit in this order of the world.
You're supposed to die before you shall win.
However,
It's not as rare as we might think.
The thing is that almost no one talks about it.
What is different from every other loss is that lack of community of someone to share experience with and lack of understanding.
With our babies,
Often,
Always,
Die our dreams,
Our hopes,
Our plans for the rest of our life.
It's basically as if a part of us was dying too.
I'll be talking about the different ways of losing a baby in another episode,
But I just want to say that there are several ways of losing a child.
Miscarriage,
Still there,
Neonatal death,
Or doesn't matter if it's that in general or after a premature birth,
Or your baby might die because of Sudden Infant Death Syndrome.
And all of those cases still are individual and different.
None of our experience are the same.
And I still feel like those experiences can connect us,
Can bring us together.
And I feel like it is important to be surrounded by people who experience something similar to you.
Now,
I want to go deeper into the difference of losing a baby to losing a parent,
A spouse,
Or another loved one.
And one thing that often happens if you lose a baby is that you have a lack of words,
Which often also comes together with a lack of support.
And it's that silence that just comes with your loss that might be your silence,
Or it's silence of people who surround you.
Maybe you haven't told anyone that you're pregnant.
Maybe they really don't know,
So they can't say anything.
And maybe people know and they just don't know what to say.
So who can you talk to if no one knew?
On the other hand,
The thing is that you want to go out and scream it in everyone's face.
You want to tell people.
People who might judge you because you're not the best at work,
Or people who seem kind and like someone who would give you a hug if they just would know.
But on the other side,
You don't want to tell anyone.
You don't want them to know.
You don't want to put the burden on them.
You don't want for them to be sad for you.
You don't want them to not know what to say.
Maybe your best friend is pregnant and you don't want to scare her about what could happen.
Or you just want to be freaking alone with yourself,
With your pain,
With your thoughts,
With your feelings,
With everything.
Maybe you just don't know what to say yourself.
How can you express what happens to you?
How can you express your feelings,
Your thoughts?
Maybe you don't want to tell anyone because you don't want to start crying while talking to them in the middle of the street.
Whatever it is,
I want to tell you that you're not alone and you're so right with whatever you experience.
You are okay to feel the way you feel and act the way you act.
There is nothing right or wrong in what you're doing or feeling.
It's just the way you feel.
It's okay to feel that way.
I've been reading and listening to a lot of stories of women losing a baby over the last few years.
I know and I'm grateful that they experience change and that a lot of women get support and understanding by family and friends.
I also know that it is not always the case and sometimes family and friends want to help.
They want you to feel better and all their attempts feel wrong and like they don't honor you,
Your grief or your baby.
I understand them.
I don't want to judge them for that.
I didn't even know what to say or what to think when my son died.
I didn't know how to cope with my grief.
But also I didn't know how to cope with the grief of my partner,
My parents.
Can I help them?
What can I say?
How can someone who never went through this know what to say,
Find the right words and break the silence?
And sometimes people just say things like,
Well,
At least you didn't experience,
At least you didn't know your child like I said at the beginning.
Nothing that is different about losing a baby is the lack of memories or rituals of mourning and grieving.
There might be nothing to remember your baby,
An item that you connect to.
Some parents have that,
Some don't.
Not only that,
But if a baby dies before or shortly after birth,
Friends and family mostly don't have the chance to meet it.
And often you as parents are the only people that have built a relationship with your baby.
No one else feels that love.
There is no common memory or relationship with your baby or your baby that you can share with others.
And that often leads to parents and siblings feeling isolated and alone with their pain.
Memories though are important for the bereaved and it gives a chance to gradually say goodbye.
So usually,
Like I said at the beginning,
When we lose a loved one,
We have the chance to talk to the people around us who knew that person to share experience that we have together.
But with losing a baby before or shortly after birth,
Those memories might be rare or non-existent for you and especially you don't share them with others.
Something I like to talk about,
Which is not necessarily different to other losses,
Is that you might have lost your baby unexpectedly.
It's often an unexpected event.
And if your baby dies,
It's really likely that you didn't expect that before.
And sometimes the death of a child comes with a longer period of bleeding or knowing that there is a defect,
But mostly it doesn't.
And the thing is that where it's different to other losses often is that you go from a time of being overly excited and hopeful and it's just like this true being on a cloud seven feeling and just like,
You know,
You're just so excited.
And you go from that high to being devastated,
Being alone,
Being in pain,
Being in complete darkness.
And on the other hand,
If you have a high risk pregnancy or if you experience,
For example,
A pre-major pregnancy or a pre-major birth and you have the time in the hospital with neonatal care before you lose your baby,
That can affect or influence yourself and you have that polarity of hope and worry.
You are still hopeful and excited,
But on the other hand,
You worry about what might happen.
And I experienced that after the pre-major birth of my son when he was in neonatal care and on life support and I knew of the high risk for him and I knew that he might die.
And on the other hand,
I really wanted to stay positive.
I didn't want to think or talk about the risks and what might happen.
So to be there for him,
I tried to be positive the whole time to send my strength and my love to him and I tried to just work out the future,
Which support he might need and I just faced everything except the chance that he could die.
And I knew he could and I had to face it after when the days showed that he is getting worse,
But it's such a balance between being strong and thinking about the worst.
And I also didn't want to manifest the worst case scenario into my life.
So yeah,
It's that mixture between being so unexpected and going from high to low or if not,
Having the time that you have together,
The short time you have together is influenced by worry and just being scared of losing your baby.
And another topic that is certainly worth a whole episode is guilt,
Shame and the feeling of being responsible for what happened.
And this might be something that a lot of people experience when they lose a loved one,
That there is something that they think they could have changed.
But if a baby dies,
The responsibility a parent feels might be bigger because of the natural and biological urge to protect your children.
And I just want you to know that your baby's death is beyond your control.
And I know it might not feel like it,
I know you might have though.
And you know,
You might feel self-doubt,
Guilt and worry about things you did or you didn't do during your pregnancy.
And you might worry if you're the one who caused the death of your baby.
Maybe you're angry at yourself or your body,
Maybe you feel betrayed by your body and you wonder why,
Why you?
Maybe you did everything right,
Like quote on quote.
Maybe you were the perfect pregnant woman who never sipped on a coffee and who were super relaxed and was taking care of everything.
So sometimes it might not even be a physical thing that you feel guilty about.
Maybe during your pregnancy you had a thought like,
Is that the right moment to have a child?
Is that the right partner to have a child with?
I won't be a good mother and I know you love your baby.
And even if you feel like maybe I didn't love it enough,
You didn't do anything wrong.
And those thoughts and things you did,
They didn't influence anything.
And you might argue with that now.
And I will definitely record another podcast about this topic because it's so close and dear to me and I know that a lot of women just struggle with that and I went through that.
I have so many things to tell you about the guilt that I felt but I also want to get some other women into that conversation and just share what they feel guilty about and share with you a way how to let go of that.
So I will definitely record another podcast.
But I want you to know that you are not alone with those thoughts and feelings and that you did nothing wrong whatever you did.
And if you feel like,
Okay,
This is certainly me and this is why I feel so terrible and I need support and I need to talk to someone who listens to me without judgment and who I can just share my deepest and darkest secrets about what I did and didn't do and what I feel might be my fault,
Yeah,
Please reach out to me.
That is what I'm doing in my job as Wave and Grow Up Coach.
And yeah,
Enough about that.
You can find details in the show notes of the podcast episode if you feel like you need that.
And so what else is special about losing a baby?
Well,
I want to say everything.
Everything you dreamed about for your child.
The ideal image you have of him or her.
The loss of the perfect future human you imagined.
And I know that parents are supposed to and probably a lot of parents do love their children unconditionally.
I know sometimes maybe not and that's okay too.
But for you,
Your baby was perfect.
The son,
The daughter you knew,
You imagined to grow to be intelligent,
Clever,
Smart,
Funny,
Beautiful,
Honest,
Courageous.
Whatever you honor for yourself,
Whatever the version,
The best version of yourself is,
The upgrade,
The 2.
0 you.
And in your imagination,
In your dreams,
In your future plans,
There are no flaws.
There are probably not even like sleepless nights,
Picky eaters,
Rebels like the normal things every child goes through.
And you never had the chance to experience all of that too,
Which might make you sad.
You know,
You didn't get to know the unique personality with all the ups and downs.
And it's so hard to let go of your perfect baby.
This also goes together with losing a future and part of yourself.
So that might sound dramatic for everyone who hasn't been there.
But if you lost your baby,
You know what I mean.
A mother who might have felt the baby inside her,
Who made a connection,
Sees it as a part of herself.
And we are looking forward to future events,
The next Christmas with your baby,
Parental leave,
Your next holidays.
You imagine all of that with your baby,
With your child.
You imagine the next years,
I bet.
And I wrote letters to my son,
Zimond,
During pregnancy,
Already imagining how he would receive them when he'll be a young man.
And all that is just gone in a moment of time.
And you'll never get it back.
You'll never experience it with this baby.
And the other thing is not knowing what you can do.
You know,
Even if you imagine your child is perfect and you'll never thought about sleeping in snights and everything,
Or maybe you think about that and you'll just think like,
Okay,
You know,
This is what I miss when I would have my child now.
I might be at home now changing diapers,
Feeding my baby,
Taking care of everything,
Smelling terrible because I didn't take a shower for the last three days,
But I've been there for him,
I could help him.
And coming home to an empty home and having nothing to do can make you feel useless.
And maybe you have other kids and you have a lot of things to do,
But you can't help your baby and you never could.
You never did anything for him or her.
And you might sit at home,
Spilling milk for no one.
This just feels so terrible,
This feeling of I can't do anything.
I can't help,
I never could help.
I was not able to hold him.
I was not able to change his diapers.
I was not even able to feed him.
And all those thoughts and feelings make it really,
Really hard.
And last but not least,
There often is a lack of professional support.
And I'm glad to know and hear that this is slowly changing or it's changing over the last years,
What health professionals have often been and sometimes are not skilled in that area.
Hospitals often don't have the right support.
Funeral arrangements can make a huge difference.
For example,
If you have someone who knows about the importance of mementos and rituals.
Also going deeper,
Having someone guiding you through your experience.
Maybe someone who experiences the same or similar thing can make a huge difference in how you experience the time.
You're not feeling alone.
And the same is having the connection to someone professional who might have the tools to help you to grieve through or might just give you the space to talk about it.
Yes,
It can just be an incredible,
Incredible important part of your grieving process to have someone,
Someone who's supporting you for your grief,
Being there for you,
Holding that space,
Listening to the same story over and over again,
Because maybe your friends don't want that anymore.
To close this episode,
I want to give you some points to remember.
And number one is that you are allowed to grieve even if no one else is supporting or understanding you.
The other thing is that friends and family might sometimes react hurtful,
But remember that they just don't know it better because they never experienced something like that.
And please don't go and shut yourself off.
Please don't go and feel like you're the victim and really no one understands you.
Number three is that you're allowed to feel every kind of emotion.
You're even allowed,
And that's something I'm going to talk about in another episode,
So much more to come,
You're even allowed to feel joy and happiness,
But you don't have to.
And you're also allowed to feel angry,
Sad,
And alone.
You're allowed to cry in the bathroom at work.
You're allowed to cry in front of everyone at work.
One of the most important points,
Number four,
Is that you will be okay.
You will survive this.
It's never going to be the same.
You'll never be the same after that.
You'll never going to forget.
You're a child,
But you will heal.
And last but not least,
You're not alone.
Reach out to other women.
Go and find professional support to talk to.
You could join my Facebook group and connect to the other women in there.
Check out the show notes if that sounds like something that might help you,
Or just reach out to me or the other women with the same experience or other professionals that might be able to help you.
Just know you're not alone and you don't need to do this alone,
And it makes a huge difference.
And with that,
I want to say goodbye.
I send you light and love from all my heart,
And I believe in you and your ability to heal.
Bye-bye.
Now I would like to play for you this little snippet that I was promising at the beginning.
Simon would be three and a half years now,
And I sometimes see kids at the same age in my work with children with autism,
And I wonder what he would be like.
How would he look like?
How would he smell?
How does he look?
Which color has his eyes?
How does his laugh sound?
How does it sound when he's crying?
I'll never know that.
And it makes losing him different.
It makes losing him harder.
