The Power Of Attention And Meditation With Renowned Expert, Sarah McLean

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Hello and welcome to the UistU Podcast.

This is Julie Riesler.

I am your grateful host,

And I am so excited to introduce you today to just a phenomenally incredible woman.

I want to tell you all about Sarah McLean.

I will say that I met her last year in Sedona at the Illuminate Film Festival and was blown away.

I'm so excited for you to get to hear her story.

So Sarah McLean is an American transcendentalist who can inspire anyone to begin or recommit to their meditation practice.

She is a global go-to teacher for contemporary meditation and mindfulness,

Who has been teaching meditation for over 20 years.

She began her personal practice while working at the TM Center in Massachusetts,

And that's where she met Deepak Chopra,

Whom she worked for for eight years,

Serving as a program director for the Chopra Center for Well-being in California.

She then traveled the world exploring and practicing various types of meditation techniques.

She lived in a traditional ashram in India and was a two-year resident at a remote Zen Buddhist monastery.

Sarah also founded the McLean Meditation Institute in Sedona,

Arizona in 2006,

Which offers drop-in meditations and classes in meditation and mindfulness practices.

It's also the home of the Meditation Teacher Academy,

An Arizona-licensed post-secondary educational facility that trains meditation teachers worldwide.

She is also the director of Feast for the Soul,

A not-for-profit organization which promotes a 40-day worldwide spiritual practice period,

Which takes place annually January 15th through February 23rd.

Sarah's bestseller,

Soul Center,

Transform Your Life in Eight Weeks with Meditation through the Hay House,

Inspires study groups worldwide.

Her latest book,

The Power of Attention,

One of my favorites,

Was released this year by the Hay House.

She is popular as a facilitator for retreats at the Chopra Center,

Esalen,

And many world-class spas such as Enchantment in Sedona and Sanctuary Spa in Scottsdale.

She's been interviewed on national television,

Featured in a variety of award-winning movies,

And her work has been tutored in the New York Times,

Washington Post,

And the Los Angeles Times.

Sarah will share her secrets to successful meditation and how the meditation path can lead to self-compassion,

Clear communication,

And a more peaceful life.

Access her free meditations and discussions at mcclainmeditation.

Com.

We'll have all the links.

Sarah McClain was one of the most just amazing,

Powerful,

Radiant,

Luminary beings I've had the pleasure of meeting.

I'm so honored,

Sarah,

To have you here today.

Thank you,

Thank you for being on the show.

Oh,

Thank you,

Julie.

I can't believe you think that about me.

I'm so honored and humbled because you meet so many amazing people.

I was just,

I was taken away by,

You know,

I remember interviewing you after the Tech Not Home film and just listening to you and hearing your story about your experience in the ashram and what you've experienced around meditation created.

It's just astounding.

And I,

You know,

I know it's changed my life and you've really,

I mean,

You've changed millions of lives and you really live and breathe that.

It was so,

You just radiate that.

So I am,

I'm so honored to have you here today.

Well thank you,

Julie.

And I love the work you do in the world and really teaching people how to become more sweet to themselves.

I think,

You know,

For me,

When I teach meditation,

One of the stumbling blocks that people really seem to get caught with is not treating themselves right.

They'll sit down,

They'll know the technique they're supposed to do.

And then somehow the story changes and it's all about how they can't do it.

There's something wrong with them.

They must be doing,

They must not have what it takes.

And you know,

So I really deal with a lot of people who have self-worth issues and sort of put themselves last.

And so meditation's really woken,

Opened my eyes,

I'd have to say,

To that lack of self-love and self-care.

I would love to,

I'm like,

There's so many areas we could go into because your life story and what you've done is just extraordinary.

I'm curious,

One of the questions I'd like to ask is,

You know,

What does it mean to be your U.

S.

U.

?

What does that look like today?

Clearly meditation being a huge part of it.

But I'm curious in your own words,

What does that mean?

What does that look like?

And maybe share a little bit how you've gotten there.

Well you know,

I believe every single one of us is born with this beauty,

This wonder,

This wisdom,

This intelligence,

This integrity,

And this ability to connect to the people and everything around us.

And what I think happens is with living the way we lived and the competition and the stress and the crazy schedules and the to-do lists and all of this grasping that we do,

And not to mention the overactivity of the stress response in the nervous system,

It's almost as if we shroud our ability to see the world clearly and see our own self clearly.

And what it means to me to be the U.

S.

U.

Is to get in touch with that part of you,

That part of me that's looking through my eyes,

That's looking through your eyes,

That you can really sense when you're sitting and being with someone.

Maybe that's what we have,

You and I,

Both when we met,

I feel like there's this ability to be together and be inspired by one another,

Not trying to get something from someone else.

And I feel like with meditation it helps to lift that veil of ignorance,

It helps to expand awareness to include everything and everyone,

And to understand our connectivity,

Whether it's a perfect stranger on the other side of the globe or whether it's an animal that you happen to meet in a park,

This ability to connect to the essence of life that is living through you as you and that lives through me as me.

That's so beautiful.

Love the idea of lifting the veil.

I love just that wording.

I am curious,

Just love to hear a little bit about your story and how you've gotten into meditation.

I know that it wasn't something that you always did,

And just wherever you'd like to start with that,

How you got into it and how that's really shaped who you are and what you do today.

Well,

I don't think I set off to be a meditation teacher or a meditation teacher trainer,

But what I can tell you is that,

And everybody can do this,

When you look back at the trajectory of your life,

Maybe what you were into as a kid,

Maybe what sort of piqued your interest,

For me it was always the mysteries of life and understanding relationships and understanding and accepting,

Whether it was reading Nancy Drew's mysteries or ordering the Time Life books on the pyramids or psychic readings.

That was really what I was into,

And then I was really into figuring out who I was.

I had a challenging home life.

Who was I beyond someone who's living with all these maniacs?

I ended up seeking peace and seeking love,

And seeking the mystery behind both.

Fast forward,

Gosh,

Probably 30 years now or 40 years now,

I started first with a meditation I pretend to meditate.

I would skip school.

I lived outside of Boston.

I would take the subway into Boston.

You know what I'm talking about.

Yeah.

And I would sit on the back of the subway,

Cross-legged,

Pretending I was meditating,

Even though I didn't know what it was.

I think it was because I had heard other people were doing it and felt peaceful around it,

And so I would assume the position,

Cross-legged,

Hands on my lap,

And sort of the okay symbol,

And waited for something to happen,

Which it really didn't.

But years later,

I had joined the Army.

I was working with soldiers with post-traumatic stress disorder and was guided into my very first meditation with a male nurse who had us explore what it was like to relax the body and move from the fight or flight response to the rest and restore response.

And so eventually,

That kind of intrigued me,

And I don't think that memory went away.

I eventually was reading a book.

I've read a lot of books.

Sometimes that's my biggest inspiration.

I know we talked about this before the call.

I was reading a book review about a book by a man named Deepak Chopra,

Who's a household name now for many of us,

But wasn't back then.

I don't think anyone knew how to pronounce his name.

And I got really interested in his approach to healing.

He was really one of the pioneers of the mind-body connection.

Even though we take that for granted now,

It wasn't necessarily something that people understood,

And it was in the late 80s.

And eventually,

I got the book that I was reading about,

And in the back of the book,

It said,

If you want to know more,

Call this number.

Well,

Meanwhile,

Between that time and reading the book,

I had met this fellow who I really liked.

He was a surfer in Florida,

A windsurfer.

And he said,

If you really want to be my girlfriend,

You're going to have to learn to meditate.

So I wanted love.

I wanted peace.

I wanted this boyfriend,

And I wanted some meaningful experience in my life.

So I learned to meditate,

Called that number in the back of the book,

And I went up to work for Deepak Chopra.

And that's where I moved into the TM Center.

Yes,

My journey has gone way beyond that,

But it was so amazing the very first time I meditated.

And I don't know for many of you if you've done it the very first time that you were kind to yourself.

What started to happen for me was I found this place called home,

This beingness that was inside me where everything was okay,

No matter what,

Where I felt whole and content,

No matter what.

And it was a glimpse of something I'd only tasted when I was in the military going through that body scan.

So I knew there was something there.

And so it led me on this journey to explore the various practices and traditions,

And really to explore the techniques even beyond tradition.

Wow.

You know,

I love that idea of really coming home to what's there within you.

And I'm just thinking for those that are listening,

You know,

What I would say is,

You know,

I know we talked about this earlier as well.

I know for me,

Learning to meditate,

Which was not easy at first,

Has been one of the things that has helped me the most in,

You know,

I've struggled,

I'm very open about struggling with emotional eating and just being able to sit still and just pause.

And it really,

Really made a difference for me to learn how to,

I mean,

Just doing it over time.

And I'm curious for those listening that,

You know,

Have had a hard time with meditating or don't know where to start or just,

You know,

I talk to a lot of people that feel like,

Well,

It's not for me.

My mind is all over the place.

You know,

What,

I don't know if you have any thoughts,

Strategies,

Wisdom for someone listening who'd really like to get into it,

But is either just starting out or not yet had that kind of home experience.

Well,

I'm going to break meditation down for you because first of all,

I've never met anyone who can't meditate.

I meet a lot of people who won't meditate,

But I've never met anyone who can't meditate.

And no matter what kind of meditation you've heard about,

Whether it's,

You know,

TM or chakra practice or Vipassana or insight or whatever,

You know,

Any meditation,

Basically every meditation has three main ingredients.

The first one is your willingness to sit down and do it.

And that means really sitting down and committing to a particular period of time,

Whether it's 10 minutes,

15 minutes,

An hour,

Whatever it may be.

It's not,

It shouldn't be arbitrary.

So you need a willingness and a resolve.

In the Sanskrit term,

It would be a sankalpa,

You know,

A resolve to do it.

The second ingredient for any meditation practice,

Regardless of its name or branding is your gentle nonjudgmental attention.

And what that means is it's the same attention that you're listening to me with right now.

Basically it's open,

It's expanded,

You're not doubting yourself,

You're not trying to focus too hard.

You're simply paying attention.

And so that's every meditation.

You don't need Jedi meditation right off the bat.

This meditation creates the Jedi ability to pay attention,

But it's not happening right off the bat.

And then the third ingredient for any meditation is one or two of the following.

A focus of something you either see,

You hear,

Or you feel.

So let's say you're using your breath,

That you're feeling your breath,

And you can do this right now while you're listening to me.

Start to feel the way that the breath moves in and out of your body.

I love it,

I'm doing it.

Maybe tune into the temperature or pauses on the edge of the exhale and the end of the inhale.

And then let's start by counting each breath.

Now this is what I did for years in the monastery.

No it's not glamorous,

No there are no fancy mantras.

You can simply breathe in,

Count one,

Breathe out,

Count two.

And keep going until you reach ten.

Now you'll have a thought occasionally and then you start again at one.

And you do this,

You breathe,

You count.

Now so you can,

That's a sound based meditation.

So you breathe,

That's a sense based meditation.

You count,

That's a sound based meditation.

You can also say a mantra or a prayer.

And you can also use a visual,

Something you see whether it's outside of yourself or like a candle flame or a star twinkling in the dark sky.

Or it could be something you imagine in your mind's eye.

So you can use a sound based practice,

A sight based practice,

Or a sensation based practice,

Or a combination.

So every meditation has those three ingredients.

So what happens though when you close your eyes like I did in the back of the subway and assume the position,

Which by the way you can just be as comfortable as you want.

You don't need any particular posture or mudras,

At least not in the beginning.

And get as comfortable as you want,

Close your eyes.

And the first thing that starts to happen is your interior dialogue gets really loud.

You know,

You start,

The to do list starts to go,

You start remembering what you forgot to do that day.

But if you stick with the practice,

You can eventually train your nervous system to turn inward,

To focus on one thing at a time,

To be more calm and alert.

So I have what's called the five essentials to meditation,

Which I wish I had learned when I was sitting in those monasteries and ashrams in India.

But here's what they are.

The first one,

And this is important for all of you,

Thoughts in meditation are okay.

It's okay to have a mental activity that's other than counting or other than paying attention to the breath or other than having silence.

Because you can't stop thinking by thinking about not thinking.

So it's okay to have thoughts in meditation.

The second aspect,

And this is what we talked about earlier,

Is to be nice to yourself in there.

Don't spend the entire time creating new neural pathways of self-hatred.

You know,

Be kind to yourself and cut yourself a break.

The third essential to meditation is to let go of any expectation you might have of what a spiritual experience should be like or what a meditation should accomplish.

The fourth is don't try to have a certain experience.

Instead,

Have the experience you're having instead of trying to make something happen.

So you let go of expectations.

You let yourself have the experience you're having,

Welcoming everything,

Resisting nothing.

And the last essential is to stick with the practice,

Even when you might have this impulse to get up and check your email,

Your phone,

Call someone back.

Stick with it during those especially uncomfortable moments because that's what trains your nervous system to be less reactive and more responsive.

And that's what we're really going for,

Is to feel peaceful,

Calm,

Present,

Responsive,

And clear.

Goodness.

I already just listening to you.

I'm like,

Wow,

I'm in a different state than I just was.

It's phenomenal.

I love that the five essentials.

Really,

I just wrote that note,

The thoughts that were okay,

Being nice.

It makes so much sense.

It's brilliant.

I never heard it that way.

It's so true.

As you're training your neurons,

You don't want to train yourself to be negative to yourself.

So that's the place to really,

I've heard it kind of being kind to your mind,

Being nice to yourself.

It's brilliant.

I never connected that,

But that makes a lot of sense to practice that right there.

I like to say,

Yeah,

How you treat yourself in meditation is how you treat yourself.

Meditation is not the end all be all.

Even though it's totally fantastic,

You're doing it so you have a better life,

Not so you have a better meditation.

You do it so you can walk through the world feeling confident,

Clear,

Being your U.

S.

View,

And so you're doing it so that you can walk easily with yourself.

That's great.

That's a great reminder,

Sarah,

That the point of it is it's not about being the best meditator on the block.

In fact,

There is no such thing,

But it's not about that.

It's really how you show up in your life,

Which is what you just said.

That's so beautiful,

And to feel that confidence and peace.

One of the things I got from your book,

The Power of Attention,

Is just the amazing possibilities that can come into your life when you are focused and have that attention.

I know as someone who's a bit of a type A doer,

There's a lot of us out there,

I'm sure people listening,

This can be an area,

Especially in our society these days with your phone,

Social media.

This is really,

It really sharpens the attention tool,

Being able to sit still.

Well,

I think not only does it sharpen it,

I think it helps you to appreciate it more.

When we go back to the components of meditation,

We look at one of them is your willingness to do it,

The other is your gentle attention.

Yeah.

Well,

People can't even read a whole book anymore.

They can barely read a page of a book because it doesn't capture their attention,

And the impatience is pretty prevalent.

Also we learn that what you pay attention to and how you pay attention is how you're training your brain.

That's why meditation works,

But that's a deliberate practice.

I think with our lifestyle today,

With everybody trying to capture your attention,

Whether it's a pop-up on a website screen or a song that people are trying to get you to download or a course someone wants you to buy or recommend,

What ends up happening is you're being called at all times to pay attention to something that you hadn't even planned on paying attention to.

It's almost like you've been hijacked.

If you can start to appreciate that you only have so much attention,

And it's a currency,

And you only have so much that you can pay,

So what is the quality of the attention you're using,

Number one?

And number two,

What is the effect of your meditation?

When you're being paid attention to,

Think about what that feels like.

When your parents or a good friend or your partner or even your dog or your kids pay attention to you and they give you that full-blown attention instead of half looking at you and half on their phone,

It really helps you to be the very best you can be.

The possibilities arise,

Your creativity is enlivened,

Your feeling connected happens,

Feeling appreciated.

I even would suggest that your gentle attention,

Your open,

Fully attention is love.

And when you start to think of your attention as a beam of love,

You start to honor it more,

Respect it more,

And recognize what you're paying attention to.

And in the world of the politics that we're dealing with today and people's divisiveness and separation,

What is it you want to pay attention to?

Because as you know,

Attention enlivens,

Whether it's a person,

Whether it's a project,

Whether it's a relationship,

Whether it's your own body.

So starting to look at the ways in which you pay attention,

Thinking of it in a different way rather than,

Oh,

I'll just multitask over here and create more stress in my nervous system.

But really look,

How am I paying attention today?

What is it that I am focused on?

And in the very beginning of this book,

The Power of Attention,

I think we end that first chapter with a whole series of questions.

I'm trying to find it here.

Do I give enough attention to the people,

Activities,

And things that are important to me?

How does someone or something respond when I give him or her my undivided attention?

How do they respond when I'm distracted by them or distracted in his presence?

Do I pay attention to and listen to my inner knowing?

How do I feel and where in my body do I feel it when I offer loving and supportive attention to a family member,

A friend,

Or a stranger?

How do I feel and where in my body do I feel it when I'm truly being paid attention to?

And so it's a whole inquiry in attention or on attention there in the book.

And I recommend,

There's probably about 10 more questions that I recommend that you pay attention to your attention.

So powerful what you're saying.

And I love the idea of it being this thought of it a currency.

Like you have a certain amount of energy or currency in a day where you put it,

Where are you deliberately putting it and shining it?

And I love the connection of attention being love.

I mean I think of,

I'll just totally throw myself under the bus.

I have two kids that on occasion I've tried to be looking at my phone,

Make them dinner.

I think I'm kidding.

Like they're not seeing it or they're not noticing it because I'm doing it in between conversations they're having.

And it's so not true.

My son calls me out all the time.

Like you're more into your phone.

I mean it's not great.

It's something I'm really working on and I realized that attention,

That undivided 100% focus is also love.

It's a way to be lovingly present.

And that is so powerful.

The idea of it being kind of thought of as currency too.

I love that.

It's really,

Really strong and powerful.

You know we were talking before I was in Mount Shasta when I was working for Gary Zukoff years ago and I didn't have a real partner.

I didn't have any pets.

I had pretty,

I was working hard but I had a lot of free time so I ended up going to the animal shelter and I was into cats at the time.

I'd never really had a dog.

And so there are so many cats that needed a lot of attention.

There were so many animals.

And I didn't know anything about attention at this time but I felt kind of bad.

You know like I can't go there because it breaks my heart.

I know so many of your listeners feel that way too.

But what I recognized is if I sat with a cat or a dog and just gave them this attention like I see you,

You matter,

You are important to me,

They sort of melted into a feeling of being home and loved.

And when my mind could stay present with them rather than oh my God who gave them up or where are they going to go or when it moved into the past or the future and really was vacillating instead of being really present with them in the present moment,

I found it was stressful.

But if I could sit with a dog or a cat and just be with them,

It was really powerful.

And I knew sometimes,

And I feel this way about people too,

That's the most important thing you can do for them.

So whether they live another day or get adopted right away or whatever may happen,

At least we had that communion.

Because I believe that if you look deeply at the USU,

What's looking through your eyes,

You know the source of that is love.

Absolutely.

God,

That's beautiful.

Well,

I so appreciate your attention and time and just,

You know,

I know we spoke beforehand and one thing I can tell everyone,

I could continue talking to you Sarah for hours because I just adore you and you have this incredible wealth of knowledge and wisdom and I love listening to you.

And I just,

I want to,

Before we get into,

We're going to go into our five rapid signature questions.

I want to thank you because anyone listening,

You know,

I think you gave some great,

Great ways to really just wherever you are to start there and I love the three,

You know,

You talked about the three parts to meditation and the five essentials and I think that really breaks it down.

So this has been fantastic to have your attention.

So I'm going to move into the five questions and whatever comes to mind,

We have not talked about these,

Everyone listening.

So the first question is,

If you could be any song,

What song would you be?

Well you know,

Have you ever heard India Ari's song,

I Am Light?

Oh yeah,

I love that song.

It's a great one.

Yeah,

That's the song I'd be.

Beautiful.

I mean,

I don't know if you've heard it,

But if you haven't,

Just Google it right away.

India Ari is a Grammy award winning artist.

She also,

I taught her to meditate and she's lovely and she's a human being just like all of us,

Stressed out and beautiful and talented and gorgeous.

It's like all of you listening and she wrote this song,

I Am Light and I encourage you to listen to it.

It will,

It's something you could listen to every single day of the rest of your life.

That's a gorgeous song.

I love her.

That is so neat and you are,

You really,

You are that.

All right,

Number two,

What is your favorite book?

Have fun with that one.

I really love,

There's so many.

I love,

Let me see,

Can I,

I'm going to say one,

But then I'll say,

But that's my other favorite.

I love the Upanishads.

The Upanishads is sort of the precursor to Hinduism.

It's more about Vedanta.

It's about that consciousness that underlies all of creation,

You know,

What the mystics and the physicists say about the unseen,

Unmanifest world.

That's where I like to dwell and so I,

I definitely love that book,

But one that I take with me to the beach is Joseph Campbell's book.

It's a great compilation.

I don't see it on my shelf.

I must have put it on the other shelf,

But it's a,

It's a great compilation of all of his work.

I love that you're looking for it.

That's awesome.

I'm sorry.

I don't know.

It's all good.

It's yellow.

It's yellow.

I carry it with them all the time and it's just all of this compilation.

So I love that.

Oh,

There it is.

Is that it?

Well,

Anyway,

No,

That's another book that I love.

So I'm not going to,

If you ask me now,

It's a hundred books on my shelf at least.

I saw them before you got it.

Yeah.

You've got quite a few.

Joseph Campbell's amazing anything.

So it's a yellow company,

It's yellow book and it's a compilation.

It's great.

People can find it.

Yeah,

It's beautiful and I'll find it,

But I just can't,

I'm sort of stuck to my microphone right here.

So I can't move.

It's all good.

What is,

What is your favorite quote or one that really inspires you?

Well,

The one,

Um,

I have a lot of them,

But I'm going to tell you the one I have memorized because I pretty much,

It is the reason that I do what I do.

It is by Lao Tzu and he is a Chinese philosopher from centuries ago who wrote the Tao Te Ching and his is all about peace on earth.

And it says,

If you really,

If you want to have peace in the world,

There must be peace between nations.

If you want to have peace between nations,

There must be peace in the cities.

If you want to have peace in the cities,

There must be peace between neighbors.

If you want to have peace between neighbors,

You must have peace in the home.

If you want to have peace in the home,

There must be peace in the heart.

So that's my job is to try to help people find what's already there,

Uncover it,

Unveil it.

Beautiful.

And that really,

I mean,

Persona alignment,

That's the whole point of the USU.

It's really getting to your essence.

So you have that peace,

Just what you're talking about.

That is so beautiful and then radiate it out.

Yeah,

Gorgeous.

What if you,

You know,

Last day on the planet and you could kind of share whatever words of wisdom you'd feel are most crucial to share with the world,

With loved ones,

What would you tell them?

Don't be afraid.

That's great.

That's very powerful.

Yeah,

That love is living through you as you,

And there's no reason for any fear at all.

Beautiful.

Last question.

What are you most grateful for?

I think it's my,

To be honest,

There's so many things,

But when I look at my life,

I love the path that I've taken.

And when I think about,

Well,

I'm not just lucky.

It's not that it's that I'm a good listener.

I'm a good listener to my interior.

And when my interior is screaming,

Take a left,

Take a left or don't marry that guy,

Or go talk to that person or call the number in the back of this book that I listened to it.

And I'm really grateful that I do that because though I've stepped in a lot of potholes,

I only do that once.

And it's led me to the most profound experiences.

Wow.

I'm really grateful that I'm a good listener.

Wow.

Well,

For those listening,

I love that idea of just really what you said about listening to your interior and acting from that place of intuition and knowing,

And then learning from those lessons and listening,

That deep listening and attention.

Oh my goodness.

It has been such an honor and pleasure.

I've just loved talking to you before.

I love talking to you here.

I want to talk to you more.

Sarah,

You're really such a special being on this planet.

You're such a gem.

And I so appreciate you and appreciate your massive gifts to the world and for sharing that today and for everyone listening.

And it's a delight and honor to know you.

And I thank you.

Well,

Thank you so much for giving me the opportunity to share.

Otherwise,

I'm just sitting solitary if my eyes close to meditation.

I appreciate being asked to share a little bit about what's going on in there.

So thank you so much.

And the work you're doing in the world is beautiful,

Empowering women,

Increasing self-love and waking people up to possibilities that their lives can really shine.

Thank you for listening and tuning in.

We are thrilled to have you as part of the UistU community.

By being your best self,

You are adding enormous value and service to the planet as you can't give away what you don't have.

If you enjoyed the show,

Please rate and recommend it on iTunes,

Overcast,

Or wherever you get your podcasts.

And you can always get more info at JulieReesler.

Com.

Cheers to you and you are becoming your UistU.