Covert Narcissism Divorce And Children: Facing Our Codependent Fears

Welcome to the Breakdown to Breakthrough podcast.

My name is Lisa A.

Romano.

I am a life coach,

Bestselling author,

YouTube vlogger,

Meditation teacher,

And expert in the field of codependency and narcissistic abuse.

I am a believer in the power of an organized mind.

My aim is to help people learn what it means to live above the veil of consciousness rather than living a reactive life.

May your heart feel blessed,

Your mind feel expanded,

And your spirit find hope as you spend time with me here at the Breakdown to Breakthrough podcast.

So today we're going to be talking about the fears of leaving a narcissist and dealing with some of the codependency issues that we struggle with when we are contemplating ending a narcissistic marriage or a narcissistic relationship.

And so narcissism essentially is a disease of personality.

It's maladaptive.

And the person who is said to be narcissistic is someone who lacks empathy and is said to have the ability to exploit the emotions of others in an effort to manipulate other people.

So a narcissistic relationship is rooted in manipulation.

Narcissists are known to lie pathologically.

They have a false sense of self and there is a difference between a covert narcissist and an overt narcissist.

A covert narcissist is somebody who is easy to spot,

Much easier than a covert narcissist.

And an overt narcissist is grandiose and has this sense that they are better than everyone and has literally just convinced themselves that they are special and unique and they feel entitled.

So think about somebody who cuts the line at the bank,

Who cuts the line at a grocery store,

Who steals,

Who will hide the work of employees or those coworkers that they work with because they want the promotion.

So they will use their friend's parking spot even though it's not their parking spot,

But they feel entitled to like parking their friend's parking spot at work because they just don't want to have to walk.

But they don't care about the other person who has to walk and it's not your parking spot.

And so if they have a desire to cheat,

They cheat and it won't be their spouse's fault that they cheat.

They'll minimize the idea of cheating.

They'll make excuses.

They'll say,

No,

It's really not cheating because she wasn't a prostitute or it's really not cheating because he wasn't married or it really wasn't cheating because I told you I was going to cheat or whatever.

There's this lack of empathy for how their actions affect other people.

They will treat their families different than they inside behind closed doors than they do outside.

And so it's really confusing if you're in a relationship with a narcissist because you understand that the world sees them in one way and you experience them in a different way and it's very maddening.

It makes you feel very topsy turvy.

And a covert narcissist is someone who is more vulnerable.

And some research suggests that a covert narcissist knows that they're inadequate and they have conflict about being inadequate,

But they are still arrogant and they will punish you for not doing what they want you to do.

They're passive aggressive.

They stonewall you.

You can't get from point A to point B.

And so there's this manipulation happening,

But it's not easy to spot.

But let's say you're at a point in your life where you're like,

I'm done.

I can't do this anymore.

I'm married six years,

10 years,

20 years,

30 years.

I've coached people who have been married for 40 years and who are just coming out of the fog and who for 40 years thought it was me.

I was just broken.

He looks so perfect.

He has a great job.

Everybody loves him or she has her stuff together and she's an executive and I quit college.

And so I coach people who have longstanding marriages who are just beginning to understand that the crazy making is enough and that the fact that they're out there Googling what is a narcissist or is my spouse a narcissist or can I save my marriage is a sign that there's big trouble.

My husband,

As far as I know,

Is not out there Googling what's wrong with my wife.

And I don't Google what's wrong with my husband or I'm just not doing it.

There's no reason to.

But so many of us turn to books.

I know that when I was trying to figure out what was wrong in my marriage and I started to finally peel away the shame that maybe it wasn't all me.

Like I knew that I had some insecurity issues and I knew that I had some codependency issues,

But maybe it all wasn't my fault.

And I started to Google the passive aggressive man and I bought a book called Living With the Passive Aggressive Man.

It was so enlightening.

And I started to realize like if I'm online Googling passive aggressive man,

How to live with a passive aggressive person,

There's a problem.

Eventually,

You know,

I got to the point where I realized that our marriage could not be saved.

And the only way it could be saved was if I continued to pretend that I was happy when I wasn't.

If I could stuff all my emotions,

If I could pretend that I didn't see what I saw,

If I could keep having babies to distract me,

If I could start another business to distract me,

If I could act like I wasn't this miserable,

Then maybe my marriage would survive.

But is that is that surviving?

You know,

Maybe back in the 1600s that flu,

You know,

Maybe the 1700s and the 1800s.

But in 2020,

Things are different.

We are awakening.

We are understanding what healthy relationships should feel like we're understanding that it's not just about making money.

It's not just about having children.

It's about living a purposeful life.

It's about feeling fulfilled.

It's not about settling anymore,

Tolerating anymore.

It's just not.

And so when we make the decision to end a narcissistic relationship,

We have to face our own codependency because we are going to worry about what the kids are going to think.

We are going to worry about them siding with the narcissist.

And make no mistake,

When you divorce a narcissist,

They will do everything in their power to make you look like the bad one.

It's going to happen.

That's why they're a narcissist.

I went through it myself.

I lost my son for a while.

I lost my daughter for a while.

And now they're 20 and 28 and 22.

And none of them have anything to do with it,

Which I think is sad.

But they're all adults now and they're able to decide what kind of relationship they want in their lives.

And unfortunately,

They've decided that their relationship with their father is a strain on their mental health because of the inability to have empathy.

He has their feeling is that he has absolutely zero empathy for what they're feeling.

And so that is dangerous when you're dealing with someone like that in the context of a relationship and you love this person.

That's their decision.

When we are deciding to divorce a narcissist,

We must face this idea that we cannot live in fear of what other people think.

We have come to decide who we are and to live that truth.

And there is going to be time.

There's going to be a time when the narcissist does their thing,

Smears your name,

Triangulates you.

That's all part of you coming out of the web that is narcissistic abuse.

We can't expect our divorce to be any different than our marriage.

We have to expect that there is going to be some collateral damage,

That it's going to be more difficult than ever.

And as someone who has survived the fire,

What I had to realize was I could not live in fear of what my children were going to think.

I had to accept that I might lose them.

I had to accept that he was going to buy them motorcycles,

Which he did,

And buy them cell phones and buy them cameras and make it really difficult for a single mom without a job,

You know,

Who could not keep up with him to make my children happy.

And I decided to strive for something much greater than just their happiness,

Which was lessons.

My goal became life lessons.

Now,

I couldn't buy them a camera.

No,

I couldn't buy them the fanciest sneakers,

You know,

Of the moment.

But I could try to teach them,

You know,

Invaluable life lessons.

And the life lesson was you have to learn to believe in yourself and stand up for yourself and live your truth in spite of what other people think.

And I just imagined if my children were in a similar situation to me,

And I thought I would never want them to stay.

You know,

I would want them to go.

I wouldn't because being afraid to leave a narcissistic relationship is like spiritual bondage.

It's physical bondage,

It's slavery.

And the fear makes you so afraid.

And I can tell you as someone who has walked through the fire,

Once you face the fear,

And you stick with it,

And you dissolve it,

And you think about what are the benefits of leaving a narcissistic relationship,

What are you teaching your children by staying?

What are you teaching your children by leaving?

How do you improve your life by standing up for yourself and eliminating this type of toxicity from your life?

What are you teaching your children about boundaries?

What are you teaching yourself?

You know,

And that really has to be what we strive for.

We have to know that we inspire other people when we learn to tell the truth,

When we learn to be our authentic self.

And that's really scary because as long as you,

You know,

Placate the narcissist,

And as long as you play the game,

Then they're happy,

The in-laws are happy,

Your parents are happy,

And the kids are happy,

Except for you.

And it can be really,

Really scary when you are codependent and you're a people pleaser and your religion tells you,

You should just put up and shut up.

It's really scary to find the courage to say,

No,

I'm going to do this.

And so I hope that this podcast has inspired anyone out there who is contemplating leaving a narcissistic relationship,

Anybody out there that has children and is worrying about what might happen with them.

Let's try to figure out how not to be codependent through this process.

Let's try to figure out how to end a relationship in a mature way because it's your right to do so.

And let's hope that you're able to teach your children that they have a right to stand up for themselves and to respect themselves and to expect to be treated with dignity and respect.

And they have a right to say,

This was a mistake and I'd like to change gears right now in this marriage because I deserve better.

I don't want to teach my children to live in fear.

I don't want to spread codependency through another generation.

I want to teach my children how to believe in themselves and to take care of themselves or respect themselves even when it's scary and especially when it's scary.

And in this way,

We inspire other people to do the same.

Your story will inspire someone else.

You may never hear about it,

But when people find the courage to be themselves and to break chains and to break cycles,

They change the world.

So I hear you if you're struggling with these types of dynamics.

I've gone through them myself.

Many of my clients are struggling with them right now and I just hope that this podcast has inspired you to believe in yourself and believe in your right to live the life that you were born to live.

Namaste,

Dear ones.

Until next time,

Bye for now.